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Using mixed rounds in mag

3.3K views 34 replies 24 participants last post by  daytonaredeye  
#1 ·
Hi, i was thinking of loading my mags with mixed rounds (self defense HP and FMJ). Here is the thinking behind this.

Lets say your in a firefight with a mass shooter and they take cover behind a wall or something similar. The HP may not penetrate but the FMJ will. So would it not be better to load with mixed rounds?

Is there a functional reason this would not work?
 
#3 ·
They should work together as long as they work separately but I would question the need. The odds of needing to penetrate cover/concealment during a self-defense scenario is pretty slim, I would think. When I carry a .380 it's loaded with FMJ in the winter and a quality JHP the rest of the year. Larger calibers are always loaded with quality JHP.
 
#4 ·
I mix up the ammo in my mags for range/practice time. This is mostly to justify to myself that my guns will fire what I feed them and can handle rapid change.
For carry purposes tho, you will never know when you might need to shoot through a wall or brick, so it's impossible to load mixed mags for that. Better to have more mags to put rounds through the same hole than carry a mixed mag. I'd rather not shoot through somebody because of a mixed mag, or worse, try to remember where the FMJ round was loaded in a gunfight.
Just my .02
 
#6 ·
I load my magazines when new and on occasion with mixed ammunition varying from different manufacture to different design to make sure that the firearm will transmission from one to the other without fault. However, the only time that I load a mix of ammunition in a magazine that I will depend on is if while counting out the rounds of ammunition I run short of defensive ammunition and then need only two or less rounds to fill the magazine. At which time I am willing to make the last two rounds to be fired a practice round which may or may not result in over penetration upon striking the intended target. But then I have always been taught to look beyond the target for any collateral impact damage.
 
#7 ·
Let's say your not in a confrontation​with a mass shooter? Now you're just slinging lead into your neighbors home. We live on a corner lot so only one neighbor is 6-10ft from us while the rest are across a street or our backyards (1/4 acre lots) butt up.
I'm not against my neighbors shooting in self defense but I'd at least hope they'd consider those around them, so I will try to do the same.
For out and about it's just as urban so my theory doesn't change and I'll load SD ammo until carrying a shotgun is legal.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
 
#10 ·
If you are in an active shooter situation and the shooter ducks behind cover, it's time for you to get out of Dodge or at least increase the distance between you and the shooter while also getting closer to an exit. Once an active shooter ducks behind cover, they are not a threat so continuing to shoot in their direction makes you the active shooter in the eyes of responding law enforcement. And continuing to shoot when you are not being shot at will greatly weaken your case in court. As far as what I carry in my EDC magazines, they're filled with Critical Duty.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Yes i agree and i understand that i am not trained in this area as would LE be. And i understand that i need to know where the exit is and use common sense that when it becomes too heated and out of control i may need to take that exit. But on the other hand i could not live with myself if i ran for the exit while others were being slaughtered, especialy children. I would have to make sure i got and kept the shooters attention on me rather than innocent defensless others at least until LE showed up and then they can handle it. I would also make the attempt to be on my cell phone with LE letting them know what was happening and also following their orders as to what to do, at least letting them know im not the bad guy.

Great replies otherwise, lots of lessons learned and i agree you cant plan for this stuff. The only part of planning you can do is being armed if it happens, anything beyond that is not going to go as planned.
 
#11 ·
I have read of mixing rounds in a shotgun to be able to deal with different threats in a particular scenario. So far as handguns, the reason to mix different rounds is to assess how you shoot. For instance, .38 and .357 in a revolver, you can see flinches and trigger pulls versus squeezes with the different rounds. The key is, you don't know the sequence in advance. My opinion, for what you put forth, load for that background. Your home, decide how much penetration is acceptable and load accordingly. Just understand the wisdom of Helmuth Karl Bernhard Graf von Moltke: "No battle plan survives contact with the enemy."
 
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#12 ·
Like others, I've heard of mixing rounds in a single mag to test function; but never to carry for some unlikely hypothetical scenario... how would you even know what order to put the rounds in until the scenario actually starts?

Makes a little more sense with a revolver, especially one like a Judge, where you can alternate .45 Colt and .410; but even then you won't know which round is more appropriate or effective until the actual engagement begins... and by that time it'll be too late to change your mind about which round you want to fire first.
 
#14 · (Edited)
Guess I'll be one of the odd ones, as usual. :mellow:

I carry hollow point AND FMJ rounds in the same magazine. Chambered round is HP and first couple of rounds in the mag are as well, followed by FMJ.

Depending on what full-sized sidearm I carry, the first 8 rounds (for the 16+1 CZ 75B) or 5 rounds (for the time-tested 1911-A1) may be HPs, followed by FMJ.
Only carry FMJ in the PT-111 G2. The short barrel already robs the bullets of velocity, so why stack the odds any further in favor of under-penetration? :-\


Rationale:
First few shots likely need to do the most damage in the least amount of time to STOP THE THREAT. Whether they expend all their kinetic energy inside the criminal or manage to make a (messy) exit wound, these first shots would be the most critical.

Next couple of shots are there for penetration. Yes, I said it. A bad word, I know (not that way! Pre-vert :p) Two holes per bullet* should be considered a good thing in terms of stopping power. Mind you, the bullet shouldn't just be flying through the criminal. Chances are it will be slowed down as it passes through soft tissue and bone.

Maybe the criminal(s) is/are behind cover or have flak vests on. Maybe their clothing just happens to be thick enough that the bullets aren't penetrating deep enough.


Just my opinion. I've heard of folks who simply alternated HP, FMJ, HP, FMJ, HP, FMJ, HP, FMJ....


*Without getting too far into it, I'm pretty sure over-penetration of Center-of-mass hits with commonly-carried sidearms is a myth. Yes, it may be a possibility for a heavy .357 or .44 load paired with a 6" barrel, but not likely for pocket pistols, snubbies, etc. If we're talking about a shot that goes through a hand or such other thin areas, then a HP would probably have zipped right through as well with enough kinetic energy to hurt someone else in the flight path. Kinda goes back to the "Know your target and what lies beyond it".
 
#16 ·
Dude - You are violating one of the gun safety rules in this situation. Know your target and beyond. I'm all for training in different environments, but when are you ever going to carry mix loads? You'd have to know in advance there was going to be a situation like you described.
 
#17 ·
I wouldn't as you'd have to remember which are which in a situation (you're under enough stress and probably won't remember). Here is a suggestion if you want to carry fmj. Load up a spare mag with it so you know if you run into that scenario, the other mag is fmj. I feel that if you get into a firefight like that and need two mags to continue firing, I'm going to be looking for a way out as my pt709 and I are in the wrong place at a very wrong time! :eek::D
 
#21 ·
What he said. Overthinking. Lots and lots of overthinking.

What ammunition does the gun shoot accurately with no failures?

Carry that.

First and foremost, self defense ammo has to work.

The gun must function reliably.

MUST.

There's no time for malfunction drills. It doesn't matter how it tested if the gun won't cycle it.

Second, you must be able to hit what you are aiming at.

MUST.

Because only hits make a difference. Misses are just making noise and wasting powder and shot.

Yeah, if it ever comes down to using a firearm in self defense, the stress is going to screw up all your plans. That's a given. There's more likely to be a LOT more pointing than aiming. I figure that using an accurate carry load becomes even more important in that case. At least you know that it will put the bullets where you are pointing.
 
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#24 ·
as long as the ammo that is in the magazine has bene tested to function in YOUR weapon then mixing ammo should not present a problem. BUT!
to me thats a real bad idea cause so what happens , do you try to keep up with what ammo is next in the chamber?
do you have a list of how they are loaded in the mag?
what if you do have a malfunction and must clear the weapon, now your list is all messed up.
and more important what if you need to fire at a bad guy in the open say 3 yards from you and a FMJ is in the chamber, do you eject it out to get to the JHP?
in my opinion if you need to defeat a barrier that will stop a bullet then that might be the time to move away cause if you can't shoot through it he can't either.
myself I had rather pay total attention to the target d how I can deal with him than trying to remember what ammo I have in the mag.
 
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#25 ·
I will add my thoughts here, just use a good S.D.round, no FMJ mixed in....................
If BG ducks behind cover, where are they going to go without possible exposure?
As long as they are pinned down, it should give you enough time to call LEO's and keep them pinned down until they show up.
As long as you are being aware of what is going on, they shouldn't be going anywhere, and if you see the white's of their eye's
looking around a placed round is either gonna hit them. or cause them to hunker down some more..................
To me it would be a waste to lobe fmj's at an obstruction they are hiding behind...................
 
#31 ·
We will all have to make that decision for ourselves should we be in that position.
Myself my plan is if you have been shooting at me and run out of ammo , have a function problem with your weapon, then it had better not be in your hand for very long or I am going to try to light you up.
and I don't plan on shooting just one time either.
 
#34 ·
I don't know myself??
I always thought that you could NOT call a time out during a gun Fight?
maybe I got it mixed up with like Badmiton or something where you can't call a time out?
 

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#35 ·
I actually do this quite a bit - at the range. I don't mind spending a box or two of the expensive stuff (high end JHPs) at the range at every outing. It's particularly important when breaking in a new (to you) gun to find out if there are any bullet shapes which might cause your gun to choke every now and the . Especially 1911s. Not as big of a problem nowadays, as the 1911 market has enjoyed quite a renaissance, but when I first got into 1911s they were still modeled on the .45 FMJ. They were originally designed for battlefield use if FMJ ammo and didn't handle hollowpoints very well but re engineering feeding mechanisms, feed ramps chamber throating, etc done at the factory have gone a long way in elevating the 1911 to the popularity it enjoys today.

Beyond 1911s, these principles still hold true. For this reason, I mix different brands of FMJ along with differing brands of JHPs in the same magazine - just to see if everything will feed, fire and eject appropriately. I'll then mix some JHPs for same reason. Then I'll gradually work toward the SD load I plan to use.