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Are people actually trying defend the mainstream press for their unbiased broadcast!? LOL! They don't even TRY to be truthful. Fox, at least, has some non-opinion based reporters that do straight reporting. The rest are editorialists and opinion is what they DO. See, you have to be able to determine which is which. Heck, I bet some here think that imbecile Brian Stelter is a hardcore newsman.

Defending NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, et.al as credible news sources is laughable at best and says more about the person doing the defending that it does those clown show networks. LOLOLOL!!!
 

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Zen, was you protesting as loud when Oregons governor called for federal troops to end a protest and then murdered Lavoy Finicum?
 
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Discussion Starter #63
Zen, was you protesting as loud when Oregons governor called for federal troops to end a protest and then murdered Lavoy Finicum?
You mean the guy who sped off from a traffic stop, blew through a road block, almost ran over an FBI agent while doing so, got out of his car and started reaching for what any rational man after having witnessed all this would think was a gun (and low and behold it turns out he did indeed have a gun on him)? All of this after having taken over government property with an armed group that they were prepared to use violence in order to illegally occupy? No, sorry I wasn't. That's not to say I wished death on the man though. I think you may have me confused on two fronts. 1. I don't plant my flag based on color or political ideology, but justice and equality. You may have found I am far more vocal in regards to race however, simply because it's been my experience that they require far more speaking up for and by comparison far more often come out on the losing end of justice and equality. And 2. If you have been actively witnessed committing a crime, you should be apprehended and arrested for said crime. My major concern with the particular topic we find ourselves posting in is that many of these individuals have not been arrested or apprehended outside of a government building in the act of a crime, but later, much further away and well off the grounds of government property, because they "meet a description". I know that little catch all CYA phrase all too well, and have seen it used unjustly and unconstitutionally on numerous occasions, even on a first hand basis. That is my issue. Not that vandals are getting arrested, but that people are getting apprehended to determine later if in fact they might be said vandals once pictures and statements are taken, ID is taken, and pockets and belongings are emptied. If troops were driving around snatching cowboy hat and plaid wearing folks up off the street during the time of that occupation because they "fit the description" you can bet you would have heard from me on the issue.

Let me make another thing clear, I have zero love for Antifa. I think they are opportunists, and anarchists, largely populated by young angry people that just want to break stuff. And as for BLM, I don't even recognize them as an actual group, but more of a mindset and ideal, much like more than 90% of the people that say they support BLM. They aren't supporting BLM, they are supporting the idea that Black Lives Matter (the only time I am even reminded that there is an actual group is when I find myself on right leaning sites like this one). But I don't want to see any of these people, or anyone else for that matter, have their rights trampled. Rights might make things a little harder for LE to do their job properly, but that's a con that comes with a much bigger pro for all of us. And for the record Anarchy would be a whole lot less appealing to many if individual rights, freedom and equality actually meant something and was distributed evenly and fairly. You'd still have angry dumb kids that just want to break and burn stuff, they would just have a whole lot less opportunity to do so.
 

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We don't want the protests to stop. In fact, we need to keep the left stirred-up as much as we can. On Nov. 3rd, we want them out protesting instead of voting and the lefties are stupid enough to do just that.
Unfortunately I think they will be blocking voting locations and intimidating Trump supporters. This wont be a pretty election.
I am beginning to believe we will see media outright lying about results in an attempt to oust Trump irregardless of the actual election results.
If you believe we won't see violence and corruption in November worthy of the third world nation we are quickly becoming I got ocean front property in Las Vegas to sell you!
 

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If black lives mattered to black people they should put their money where their mask is and STOP KILLING EACH OTHER!! Chicago, LA, Detroit, SF, Portland, Seattle, the list goes on. Black lives should demonstrate that black lives matter to black people and quit the black whining about the po-lice. Until they do that, they are simply black hypocrites killing innocent black lives. This behavior is disgusting and the apologists in this group are disgusting.
 

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You mean the guy who sped off from a traffic stop, blew through a road block, almost ran over an FBI agent while doing so, got out of his car and started reaching for what any rational man after having witnessed all this would think was a gun (and low and behold it turns out he did indeed have a gun on him)? All of this after having taken over government property with an armed group that they were prepared to use violence in order to illegally occupy? No, sorry I wasn't. That's not to say I wished death on the man though. I think you may have me confused on two fronts. 1. I don't plant my flag based on color or political ideology, but justice and equality. You may have found I am far more vocal in regards to race however, simply because it's been my experience that they require far more speaking up for and by comparison far more often come out on the losing end of justice and equality. And 2. If you have been actively witnessed committing a crime, you should be apprehended and arrested for said crime. My major concern with the particular topic we find ourselves posting in is that many of these individuals have not been arrested or apprehended outside of a government building in the act of a crime, but later, much further away and well off the grounds of government property, because they "meet a description". I know that little catch all CYA phrase all too well, and have seen it used unjustly and unconstitutionally on numerous occasions, even on a first hand basis. That is my issue. Not that vandals are getting arrested, but that people are getting apprehended to determine later if in fact they might be said vandals once pictures and statements are taken, ID is taken, and pockets and belongings are emptied. If troops were driving around snatching cowboy hat and plaid wearing folks up off the street during the time of that occupation because they "fit the description" you can bet you would have heard from me on the issue.

Let me make another thing clear, I have zero love for Antifa. I think they are opportunists, and anarchists, largely populated by young angry people that just want to break stuff. And as for BLM, I don't even recognize them as an actual group, but more of a mindset and ideal, much like more than 90% of the people that say they support BLM. They aren't supporting BLM, they are supporting the idea that Black Lives Matter (the only time I am even reminded that there is an actual group is when I find myself on right leaning sites like this one). But I don't want to see any of these people, or anyone else for that matter, have their rights trampled. Rights might make things a little harder for LE to do their job properly, but that's a con that comes with a much bigger pro for all of us. And for the record Anarchy would be a whole lot less appealing to many if individual rights, freedom and equality actually meant something and was distributed evenly and fairly. You'd still have angry dumb kids that just want to break and burn stuff, they would just have a whole lot less opportunity to do so.
Wow, did I step in a delusion.
 

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I agree, but more like 62% to 38%, of our country's people don't support fascism or fascists, and in particular, trump. Though I think we'll be ok once that criminal is voted out of office.
If you think Donald Trump is a fascist, then you're pretty disconnected from reality.

Chris Wallace after last weeks interview where he absolutely skewered Trump with facts while Trump was trying to do his normal BS routine.
Oh, so Fox is just about entertainment, and they never tell the truth, but their anchors actually conduct challenging interviews of the President? Hmm, must try to reconcile that...
 

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Well, I mostly watch fox for world news and opinion shows, but I fall back to newsmax.
 

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Discussion Starter #69
If you think Donald Trump is a fascist, then you're pretty disconnected from reality.



Oh, so Fox is just about entertainment, and they never tell the truth, but their anchors actually conduct challenging interviews of the President? Hmm, must try to reconcile that...
Generalized statements don't account for outliers and exceptions. Even Fox has a few of those thankfully.
 

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If you think Donald Trump is a fascist, then you're pretty disconnected from reality.
I think really "they" have created a new mental disorder. It is quite infectious and debilitating.
 

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Civil, what does that word mean? I get rights. If a mayor holds back law enforcement from enforcing the rule of law is that not a violation of peoples 'civil rights'?

You don't have to be a minority to have 'civil rights'

And historically if a state or city violated civil rights the federal government has stepped in have they not?
 

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Inviting, empowering, enabling, and endorsing anarchists is going to have long-lasting issues that the liberal mayors and governors and their failed responses to civil disorder are responsible for.

Entrepreneurs, businessmen, investors, regardless of their ethnicity and background-- who in their right mind would look at what's going on and say, "Yeah -- THAT'S where I can invest my money or start my business,"? What assurances can any of these political leaders offer regarding protection of property and persons that can be taken seriously?

For those already there -- why would they stay after being betrayed and disregarded in this way?

The ones who can leave will. The ones who have the investment money available will take it elsewhere. The people who bring jobs, culture, opportunity -- they will be gone. Quietly, gradually, and without fanfare. Just -- gone.

The ones who will be left behind are the ones who can least afford to move. The people who are most vulnerable and most dependent. The ones who benefit the most from the people who are driven away by their "leaders'" abdication to the mob.

Is what's going on Constitutional? Hell no, it's not. There is a part of the Constitution that outlines the responsibility of the government. Among those responsibilities are, ". . . to establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, . . . promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity . . . .".

There are local and state leaders who are definitely NOT meeting any of those Constitutional responsibilities.
 

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Inviting, empowering, enabling, and endorsing anarchists is going to have long-lasting issues that the liberal mayors and governors and their failed responses to civil disorder are responsible for.

Entrepreneurs, businessmen, investors, regardless of their ethnicity and background-- who in their right mind would look at what's going on and say, "Yeah -- THAT'S where I can invest my money or start my business,"? What assurances can any of these political leaders offer regarding protection of property and persons that can be taken seriously?

For those already there -- why would they stay after being betrayed and disregarded in this way?

The ones who can leave will. The ones who have the investment money available will take it elsewhere. The people who bring jobs, culture, opportunity -- they will be gone. Quietly, gradually, and without fanfare. Just -- gone.

The ones who will be left behind are the ones who can least afford to move. The people who are most vulnerable and most dependent. The ones who benefit the most from the people who are driven away by their "leaders'" abdication to the mob.

Is what's going on Constitutional? Hell no, it's not. There is a part of the Constitution that outlines the responsibility of the government. Among those responsibilities are, ". . . to establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, . . . promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity . . . .".

There are local and state leaders who are definitely NOT meeting any of those Constitutional responsibilities.
One of the absolute best answers yet!!
Nailed thevresponse about how it isn't constitutional!
That highlights why the federal government response is constitutional!
 

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The Feds are only responsible for Federal properties and employees. The state and municipalities are responsible for everything else. When the states support or encourage vandalism or violence against Federal properties, they need to be held accountable. In this case the mayor was actively participating in the attacks and must, under federal law be arrested and charged. Pulling all federal resources is also within the power of the president. What will result is exactly the same as what happened 155 years ago; a conflict between the Federal Government and states rights. Again we see this as a battle that will develop over slavery. This time it's just a different type of slavery. Why are civil war monuments being destroyed? perhaps the new secessionists don't want the demotivational reminders.

If we look back on history around the civil war, and start really delving into what happened, we saw brother fighting brother, neighbors fighting against each other over lofty ideals that were often unattainable while maintaining domestic tranquility. The Civil war of 1865 wasn't about slavery. It was over states rights vs federal power. Slavery was just one manifestation of the division. Slavery was all but ended in the south prior to the start of the civil war but there were still many slave owners in the north that kept their slaves even after the war ended. Power divisions came about over identifying what a citizen was. Can a person only be seen as 3/5ths a person in regards to a Census which determines congressional representation? The south said "no. A person is a person." The North didn't want slaves to be seen as citizens as that would shift the power to the south. President Lincoln only wanted a unified nation and would use whatever federal force necessary to accomplish that. The 13th amendment put that debate to rest but only after the damage was done.
Today we see the division of people wanting cradle to grave care and subservience to the Fed Gov't. This mentality spits on the hundreds of thousands of men and women that gave their lives to defend the United States and the beacon of liberty that it represents around the world. They want communism, socialism, marxism and totalitarianism believing it can work "this time". They forget people infinitely smarter than they are have tried and failed accomplishing that for centuries. Admission that one is wrong is perhaps one of the hardest things for a brainwashed person to do. They will fight to prove they are right even to the cost of their own lives even when it's been demonstrated constantly, they are in the wrong. This is what zealots do.
 

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...

The ones who will be left behind are the ones who can least afford to move. The people who are most vulnerable and most dependent. The ones who benefit the most from the people who are driven away by their "leaders'" abdication to the mob.
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Great post. The ultimate irony is the ones who are the most vulnerable and dependent are the ones who just torched and burnt down the very businesses that would have been vital to rebuilding those communities. So now you have the 'oppressed' people who complain about jobs and not having a living wage who have just violently driven out the means needed to obtain the things that they said they need the most. All aided and abetted by the moronic democrat politicians. I mean, how stupid ARE these people!?

<... awaiting the obligatory apologist retort...>
 

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Great post. The ultimate irony is the ones who are the most vulnerable and dependent are the ones who just torched and burnt down the very businesses that would have been vital to rebuilding those communities. So now you have the 'oppressed' people who complain about jobs and not having a living wage who have just violently driven out the means needed to obtain the things that they said they need the most. All aided and abetted by the moronic democrat politicians. I mean, how stupid ARE these people!?

<... awaiting the obligatory apologist retort...>
I am neither oblong, nor am I an Apologist (Hell, even the Rosicrucians wouldn't allow me in.)

But to offer an answer, albeit a rather tenuous one, "You haven"t even begun to imagine! There will be an enormous amount of pure, bat-guano CRAZY on display by some of our populace, both in positions of "leadership" and in their followers ( as in "useful idiots") before anyone can even begin to fathom the full and unvarnished answer to that one. There will be blood spilled, knuckles skinned, heads busted, public and private property damaged and destroyed, families wrecked and trusts broken before we even have an inkling of the limits of how stupid some of our neighbors can get.
 
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