Sure can.

 

I fired +P thru the PT145 everytime I was at the range just enough to make sure it shot my favorite +P rounds OK. I don't want to shoot too many +P, though.

 

I shoot +P in mine all the time. The manual gives you that pseudo warning about 230 grain bullets at 835 fps, but the catalog clearly states that all Taurus pistols (with the exception of a couple revolvers) will handle a steady diet of SAAMI spec +P ammo. +P is only 10% more pressure than standard velocity stuff (21,000 psi vs. 23,000 psi) and the PT145 is certainly robust enough to handle it. I sprung mine a little heavier with 19 lb recoil springs (which are a little more than 10% stiffer than the stock 17 lb unit) just to be on the safe side. I wind up leaving the heavier springs in for standard velocity stuff too as it cycles fine, and there's a noticeable reduction in recoil.

And one other note on the warning in the manual - to get a 230 grain bullet to exit that 3.27" barrel at 835 fps will pretty much require a +P load. Standard velocity stuff (like wwb) is going to be more like 700 fps from the PT145. I guess the lawyers missed that little detail when they were writing the manual ;D.

 

And one other note on the warning in the manual - to get a 230 grain bullet to exit that 3.27" barrel at 835 fps will pretty much require a +P load. Standard velocity stuff (like wwb) is going to be more like 700 fps from the PT145. I guess the lawyers missed that little detail when they were writing the manual .

I agree, it does take a bit more push to get decent velocity with a 3 1/4 barrel. I just ran a bunch of different bullet/powder loads in four different pistols and there is quite a bit of drop off from the 4" XD and the PT145. But then the XD has always shot faster than other 4" 45's that I've measured. I still amazed at how well the PT145 handles the recoil of +P stuff.

 

I just shot 50 230g +P Hydra-shoks in mine yesterday. Ran well.

 

I just shot 50 230g +P Hydra-shoks in mine yesterday. Ran well.

Not to hijack, but I have to ask - did you run it on the Glock/Wolff spring assembly?

 

Yes. It worked fine. I don't know that I could tell much reduction in recoil when I shot some PMC 230g. I shot 10 with factory rod and 10 with the glock rod. I don't know if I could or should try to up another pound or so on spring weight. When I order some springs for my snubbie I might grab one since I don't have to deal with the rod itself.

 

When I installed mine I checked the pull weight of the slide - it took 18.5 lbs to pull the slide back to the catch with the stocker, and 20.5 lbs with the Wolff assembly. I fired mine with +P's using the stocker and the Wolff, and I could sure tell the difference. It's not so pronounced with standard velocity ammo, but I can tell the difference there too. Course I shot a bunch of ammo when I was testing, so I was pretty in tune with the feel of the recoil. You could probably stiffen the springs by another pound, but for the purposes of buffering +P's you should be fine with the 19 pounder. Reliability is probably going to be better with the 19 vs a heavier spring, though, so if it was me I'd leave it at 19.

 

Ok thanks. I figured it would be drastic with standard velocity. I didn't shoot any +P with the factory spring this time, but have shot some +P rangers and knew it has some boost. I guess the +P this time felt more like standard velocity with the 19 lb spring.

I guess in my mind I was expecting something like the feel of my 9mm OSS. So I dont know if that was unreasonable or not. If I can get it to feel closer to the 9 then I would be ecstatic, but if thats a pipe dream, then I am still good with how it worked out.

 

You might try some lighter weight bullets - the 230 grainers produce the stiffest recoil. I've got several boxes of Remington 185 gr +P golden sabers that I'm going to do some testing with later this week. I actually prefer the recoil of a .45 compared to a 9mm - to me it's more of a push than the snap you get with 9mm. Personal preference I guess.

 

I personally feel the whole +P issue in the .45 ACP is "much-ado-about-nothing".

The 100 year old .45 ACP made it's combat/manstopper reputation with 230 gr. harball ammo.

I'm not advocating using it exclusively, but to mearly illustrate the time prove axiom "a 9mm JHP may expand, but the .45 ACP never shrinks".

In this caliber select what you shoot the best in your particular gun and don't worry about selecting "the magic bullet"...it doesn't exist.

Shot placement is King...

 

The 100 year old .45 ACP made it's combat/manstopper reputation with 230 gr. harball ammo.

It's worth noting that the .45's rep was built with a 5" barrel and a 230 grain bullet traveling 835 fps. What +P ammo will do in the short barreled PT145 is to get it's muzzle velocity more inline with a 5" - and 100 fps wiil make a pretty drastic difference in expansion and penetration. I agree with you that shot placement is king - a .22 in the apricot will shut someone off just as well as anything else. A .45 tears up a lot of tissue though, with a big permanent crush cavity and a huge temporary stretch cavity. Your shots don't have to be as close to the mark to damage or destroy internal organs with a .45. It's also interesting to note that the army went to the .45 after the abysmal failure of the .38 long colt. Presumably the guys armed with the .38's were trained in it's use, but evidently hitting a vital spot is more difficult in combat than on the shooting range. I'll take all the fudge factor I can get.

 

I tend to agree Moondawg, but also with that said, back then they probably couldn't even imagine shooting those out of a 3.25" barrel, and true enough the velocity isn't quite the same.

But no matter how you slice it, the 230 grain round nose at nearly a 1/2" wide at 700 fps probably isn't going to feel much better entering one's person than a lighter bullet moving at 150 fps faster.

 

....But no matter how you slice it, the 230 grain round nose at nearly a 1/2" wide at 700 fps probably isn't going to feel much better entering one's person than a lighter bullet moving at 150 fps faster.

That's the point, even at 700-750 fps that 230 grainer is gonna dump all it's energy into the target.

Even if every projectile fired turned into a "mushroom" it doesn't mean much if it doesn't hit a vital organ or shut down the central nervous system. Case in point...

On November 20th, 1992 during a traffic stop on I-95 Cpl. Marc Coats of the South Carolina Highway Patrol shot Richard Blackburn 5 times "center mass" with 147 grain .357 magnum rounds. Blackburn fired one .22 lr round from a derringer that slipped under Coats vest in the arm pit area and severed his aorta killing him.

All five .357 rounds mushroomed perfectly, yet Blackburn never lost consciousness, and was sitting up right carrying on a conversation with back up troopers when EMS personel arrived.

This traggic incident illustrates the monumental importance of shot placement over caliber or velocity.

 

Even if every projectile fired turned into a "mushroom" it doesn't mean much if it doesn't hit a vital organ or shut down the central nervous system.

The same could be said for any round - but with the smaller calibers you generally have a smaller 'sweet spot'. What I mean by that is this - if your bullet makes a three inch permanent crush cavity, then if that bullet gets within 1.5" of a vital organ it's gone. If it only makes a one inch crush cavity, then you have to get within 1/2" of the organ. With a round that does more damage, you in affect have a bigger target that you can hit and still do the job.

As far as the .357 is concerned - it's a fast .38. L. Neil Smith came up with a ballistic calculation that takes into account a bullets cross sectional area that he termed 'efficacy.' That calculation has turned out to be a very accurate predictor of actual bullet performance in live targets. Here's a calculator that includes the efficacy calculation - play around with the velocities a little bit, and watch what it does to efficacy - http://billstclair.com/energy.html#efficacy. Compare the efficacy ratings between smaller caliber rounds and .45's and you'll see why I carry a .45. And it you do a little playing around with the velocities on the .45, you'll see why I like the +P's.

In response to people taking hits and not stopping - I've noticed the same kind of thing when small game hunting. Some animals just seem to be able to soak up a lot more damage than others, and it isn't always shot placement - sometimes it's just a tough ass animal. I think the same can be said for people, and on the off chance that I may be confronted with a 'tough one' I put the hottest stuff in my PT145 that I can find. Like I said, I want all the fudge factor I can get. I may be in a position where I can't take well aimed shots, and under those conditions I want the bullet doing more than it's share of the job. While I agree that shot placement is king, there are also plenty of stories of combatants being hit in extremities with .45 caliber rounds and going down. I guess it just depends on who you're up against. Me - I'm packin' for Magilla Gorilla .

 

I just got back from the range, and I chronoed several different .45 loads in the PT145, and also in a 5" 1911. If you're interested, here's where you can see the results - http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=49684.0

 

the old hit em in the arm with a 45 will take him down story.. 10mm is my favorite ,still have my 1006 and witness match in 10. heavy though. wish Taurus would make a polymer pistol in 10mm. Carrying a 9mm ( my pt 111 pro)with short barrel +p gold dots makes me as safe as carrying a 45. And a gorilla would laugh at a 45 bullet. and they would be removing your gun from his dung..