[Nightshade]

So, the other day I was involved in a rear end collision. Nothing major, just a kid not paying attention smashed his car into mine. Insurance info was exchanged, and the highway patrol was called to the scene. The Trooper was young, still wearing his academy graduation ring. I handed him my driver's license and my ccw permit, and informed him I was armed. His whole demeanor instantly changed. He almost yelled at me,"where is the gun? Do not reach for it, just tell me where it is". I calmly told him it was holstered in the 4 o'clock position on my hip. He then had me face his cruiser and had me lace my fingers behind my back. He then held my fingers tightly and said he was going to disarm me. He lifted my shirt, exposing my firearm, and asked "is there a round in the chamber?". I said "yes, sir". Then he asked "is the safety engaged?". Again, I replied "yes, sir". He then instructed me "do not move, I am going to remove your weapon". The Trooper then disarmed me, removed the magazine and cleared the chamber. He then pocketed my gun and magazine and frisked me, removing my keys and the small keychain knife from my pocket. He also removed my spare magazine. He then asked me if I had any other weapons or contraband. I said "no, sir". After he was satisfied I did not, in fact, have a rocket launcher in my pants or a bomb under my shirt, (not for lack of looking) he locked my gun and spare magazine in the trunk of his car. He then gave me a report to fill out about the accident. I completely understand the officer was just looking out for his own safety, but it made me feel like I was a common criminal. The kid's father, in the meantime, had shown up, and told the officer he had a ccw permit as well. The officer asked him if he was armed and he told him "no". The officer did not search him, even though he had a rifle in a gun rack in the back window of his truck. I was the victim in the accident, but the officer made me feel like I had done something wrong because I was legally carrying a handgun. After I had filled out my report and the officer had called in my driver's license and found nothing in my file, he returned my handgun, but told me "do not reload it until you have left the scene". Maybe I'm making too much out of this, but I felt violated. It's not like I was trying to hide the fact that I had a gun. I was forthright as soon as I made contact with the officer and told him I was armed. I was not agitated or upset about the accident. I'm sure, being that the Trooper was a new rookie, he was trying to be safe, but I feel he went a bit overboard.

 

[Taurus10]

I once was pulled over by a Houston police officer because of a dead tail light. I handed him both my DL and CHL but he didn't care about the CHL. He handed it back to me right away and he didn't even ask if I had a weapon with me or not. He advised me to replace the light then let me go.

 

[jimbo44]

Nightshade, I agree with you. Some mamas babies never grow up.

 

[RScottie]

I would attempt to speak to this officer's superior and tell them what occurred. If they do not wish to speak to you, ask them if you can file a report as you are concerned about an overly nervous rookie that treated you like a criminal when you were legally carrying a concealed firearm.

You should not be treated like a criminal for exercising your rights.

I have been pulled over a few times over the years while armed and have never been treated poorly.

 

[william]

His "safety" threshold was higher than your "over reaction", threshold.
You could talk, calmly and politely to his sargent, but that may put you on the radar.
Or you could put it down to "newbie nerves" and go on.
The bottom line, everyone went home.

 

[SixFalls]

I agree that he handled the situation poorly, and I even think that it should be reported. That being said, these are dangerous times for LEO's. (He was still overboard and a little stupid. Criminals done hand you a CCW.)

 

[Nightshade]

I agree that he handled the situation poorly, and I even think that it should be reported. That being said, these are dangerous times for LEO's. (He was still overboard and a little stupid. Criminals done hand you a CCW.)

I completely agree, these are dangerous times for LEO's, they are also dangerous times for law abiding citizens like myself. That's why I legally carry. Aside from a speeding ticket, I have NEVER been in trouble with the law. I have the utmost respect and courtesy for law officers. I guess I'm just a little offended that he treated me like I was a threat. It was humiliating to be detained, frisked, and relieved of my firearm when I had done nothing to warrant such actions. But, oh well. No harm no foul I guess. He was a rookie and just looking out for his own safety and I can't blame him for that. Just sayin', it was humiliating.

 

[53rdcard]

It is also possible that is how they teach them to react to a situation where a person involved in something that required the police to be called, is armed, and he just hasn't had enough time on the job to find a better way of disarming you for the duration of the time it takes to handle whatever it was he was called for.

From his stand point, you might have been someone who while never having been in trouble, is on the last straw and the kid that hit you is about it lip off, or the kids father, and then the officer has left a person who just snapped, armed.

My personal opinion is, he overreacted, however with the crazy out in force these days, one never knows how one will react. Such as, had the father said he was armed, the officer might have done the same thing to him, because he would have thought that the father might be the person one straw from snapping, and he might just shoot the person who he perceived as hurting his kid, even if it was the kids fault, parents never seem to be able to accept that.

 

[scoutfish]

To me, it wouldn't so much be his actual actions, but the emotion or attitude during the actions>

Probably a policy they may have just started along with nerves.

I understand disarming for a temporary amount of time, just don't act like I am a petty thief while following policy.

 

[AOCM.RET]

If it is not the law in Ohio to disclose you are a CCW holder and armed, then I would not say anything. Here in Florida, we are not required to disclose this information when stopped.

I would think that in a state that required disclosure, they would be a little more tactful in dealing with the situation. I understand providing a safe environment for all, but to manhandle you like a criminal is totally uncalled for in my opinion. From his attitude and actions with you, he should have frisked the father as well. How did he know the guy was not lying?

I think I would inquire about the standard procedures to be followed by a LEO, for this type of encounter at the police HQ, but do not provide the officers name, unless asked for by the person you are speaking with.

 

[jonrjen]

I got rear ended on a Monday afternoon in a new F150 crewcab that I had purchased the previous Saturday night. Knowing that Texas Law allows LE to remove your conceal carry weapon in what could be a stressful situation as soon as I was comfortable with the party who hit me, I secured my weapon into the glove box and locked it. When the officer arrived I handed her my drivers license and CHL. She asked if I was carrying or had a pistol. I told her that after meeting with the young man who hit me and feeling comfortable with his demeanor that I secured my weapon in the locked glove box and also locked the truck.

From that point she told me she appreciated what I had done and informing her as soon as she arrived. I hadn't even received a Proof of Insurance card yet, which is an automatic tow offence in that city. But, due to my actions she let me drive away with the promise that I would contact my insurance agent and have a copy of my insurance faxed to her.

So did your Trooper overreact, maybe. Was he with in his rights to do so, you bet ya.

 

[RScottie]

Here is my take on LEO's disarming someone that has a CCDW as some will justify it based on LEO safety.

I think that an officer disarming someone that has informed him that they are carrying is giving himself a false sense of security. I say this because a criminal would never tell that he has a firearm and thus would retain his firearm in a non-criminal LEO encounter such as the automobile wreck you were in.

Instead, the officer should ASSUME that everyone is armed at all times and that he needs to read each person and their actions to determine if they are about to pull a gun and start shooting. In other words, the LEO needs to always be on his toes.

In fact, I would go on further by saying that by disarming the CCDW Permit carrier the officer has put himself at less of an advantage because if another person at the scene is armed and decides to take out the officer, the law abiding CCDW Permit holder would become a target instead of someone that may instead save the officer's bacon.

I was in a simple fender bender where I was rear ended sitting at a red light. It did only minor damage as the guy behind me let his foot slip off the brake (he said that) but it activated his airbag.

Anyway, when I told the responding Deputy that I had a permit and was armed, he just thanked me for telling him and went on with writing up the report. It was not mentioned again. The guy that hit me gave me a surprised look but he didn't care either.

 

[TXEric]

I once was pulled over by a Houston police officer because of a dead tail light. I handed him both my DL and CHL but he didn't care about the CHL. He handed it back to me right away and he didn't even ask if I had a weapon with me or not. He advised me to replace the light then let me go.

Buddy of mine in Highland Village made a quick grocery store run one day, got pulled over. Handed the cop his DL & CHL, cop asked him if he was armed. Buddy said no (he was just making a quick 2-mile jaunt to the store), and the cop not only handed everything back and didn't ticket him, he also read him the riot act - "WHY would you take the time and expense to get your CHL and NOT carry your weapon??"...

I love Texas...

 

[chicagotrauma]

I would speak to the rookies supervisor

 

[scoutfish]

Well, if you really wanted to have fun and see him really freak out, you could have said:

"Sure , you can take my gun, but what are you gonna do about the guy on the roof with the sniper rifle?"

 

[MikeyB]

Buddy of mine in Highland Village made a quick grocery store run one day, got pulled over. Handed the cop his DL & CHL, cop asked him if he was armed. Buddy said no (he was just making a quick 2-mile jaunt to the store), and the cop not only handed everything back and didn't ticket him, he also read him the riot act - "WHY would you take the time and expense to get your CHL and NOT carry your weapon??"...

I love Texas...

This happened to a buddy of mine a few years ago when he was pulled over by the DPS and wasn't carrying that day. Officer said, 'Why aren't you? You got the license!'

 

[Waltherfan01]

Really. Sucks that it happened, but at least you did get your gun back.

 

[Mikeo]

Nightshade, where in Ohio was this. I want to make sure I don't travel there. That rookie was WAY out of line. He needs much more training.

 

[Fishinkeylargo]

Seems a little much if you ask me. At least the rookie didn't shoot you on the spot. If I remember correctly you must immediately disclose in Ohio, that being the case you did not have much choice.

As pointed out in FL you do not have to unless specifically asked. From my experience they always ask so I offer my CWL with my DL as the approach the car.

 

[GhostHorse]

I can understand how you feel. You've said the basic issue is how he made you feel. I'd suggest contacting his supervisor, and when doing so, making a very conscious effort not to copy the rookie's mistake.

Let me explain what I mean. If you contact the LT and go in with a chip on your shoulder demanding that this rookie be read the riot act, you'll put the LT on the defensive. You've made yourself a problem to be solved, and the easiest solution is a brushoff. Heck, if you sound POed, he'll probably think "boy, I'm glad I didn't have to deal with this guy in person while he was armed. My officer showed real restraint!" If, on the other hand, you go in with a "hey, here's what happened, should I have done something differently? What's the force policy on this? Equip me to be as supportive and helpful as possible, okay?" Now, unless he's really got a chip on his shoulder, he'll see you as a very reasonable, helpful, determinedly law-abiding citizen. If the rookie broke policy, it's pretty safe to assume the rookie will get some remedial training. Especially since the LT will probably be thinking "This is the guy my officer treated like a criminal?"

Just my $.02.