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Cimarron said:
hotbrass, you seem pretty knowledgable. What do you think about Stephen Camp's observation that the Sig-Sauer is designed to delay the retraction of the primer to keep debris out of the firing pin channel and they (primer wipes) are normal?
I dont see Stephen Camps post here. I have never gotten a primer wipe from a properly timed 1911. I have two Sig 226 and neither of them exhibit any primer wipe. In all cases the primers are only flattened.

I have a Taurus 24/7 Pro LS 9mm and it has primers that protrude like the pictures here. So it may just be a case of the tolerances and design that is acceptable to Taurus.

An optimally functioning semi auto firearm should not extract the fired case until enough pressure has dropped to prevent the case from being subjected to stresses that would damage the case, primer, or gun.

Most people will accept functionality as their only critera. So if the gun works all the time and the primers look like hell, why worry?
 

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Cimarron said:
hotbrass... I am not disputing your observation, but when someone of Stephen Camp's reputation makes an observation http://actionsbyt.blogspot.com/2006_08_27_actionsbyt_archive.html I like to try to compare information.

Take this as honest curiousity, not a disputation
Thanks for the web address.

Yes I saw the reference. But I dont see anything I said or he said that is in any way contradictory.

One thing that did not make sense to me that you wrote was "Sig-Sauer is designed to delay the retraction of the primer to keep debris out of the firing pin channel and they (primer wipes) are normal?"

This is not correct. There is no "retraction of the primer" it is the firing pin. Thats fine, it is likely what you meant anyway.

I dont know if Sig designed it that way or if that is just the way it turned out. But that is not the observation that is the topic of discussion in this thread. As long as it does not interfere with the proper function of the firearm, then I dont see any relevance.
 

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Let me clarify... here is the image to position you on the page...



Here is the quote...

These Corbon DPX cases were fired in the Kimber (left) and SIG-Sauer (right). Neither shows the classic signs of excessive pressure, but one can see very minor primer flow beginning on the primer fired in the Kimber. Neither case exhibits flattened primers. The telltale firing pin "wipe" is present on the primer fired in the SIG-Sauer. This is typical and to be expected. The SIG-Sauer pistols purposely have a bit slower firing pin retraction to help thwart debris from entering the firing pin channel.


hotbrass: You mention a problem of the timing being off because the barrel is linking down before the pressure has dropped. I don't guess I have an idea of exactly what you mean... please educate me on this and can you give me some sites to diagram what this looks like.
 

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See link below for the diagram.

http://www.m1911.org/full_1911desc.htm

If the pressure has not decreased when the cartridge is being extracted, the walls will still be pressured against the chamber and the primer will still be under pressure. This results in the case being forcefully extracted and may show pressure signs on the primer and other areas such as rips in the case head.

On a 1911, and most other centerfire pistols, the barrel links down after about 1/16 - 1/8 inch of rearward travel. When the linkdown occurs and the barrel is still pressurized, the primer will still be flowing and parts may be torn away by the head being dragged along the breach face of the slide.

With proper timing, as you see in the video link, there is plenty of time for the pressure to decrease enough for a easy extraction and ejection.
 

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OK... then what causes the linking to get out of time, what "adjusts" this timing and how can it be fixed?
 

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hotbrass said:
On a 1911, and most other centerfire pistols, the barrel links down after about 1/16 - 1/8 inch of rearward travel. When the linkdown occurs and the barrel is still pressurized, the primer will still be flowing and parts may be torn away by the head being dragged along the breach face of the slide.
hotbrass, could you please say which non-1911 type pistols also use the barrel link? I'm not sure which other models use that system.

And if anyone here would like to read more of Stephen A. Camp's stuff here's the link to his site (the link above is a friends blog). There are many informative articles there.
http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/

Steelheart
 

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Sorry you are confused by the term "link down". Maybe I should have used the term "cam down". But you would probably be asking where the cam is if I said that.
 
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