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Starfire is a proven design and been tweaked but not at that price.

You can get the Bronze JHP version.

This is from the PMC ammo site.
Jacketed Hollowed Point (JHP)

Pistol JHPExposed lead at the tip of the PMC Jacketed Hollow Point rapidly initiates uniform, controlled expansion that progresses to the full depth of the cavity. Penetration is also controlled for maximum energy transfer to the target, assuring its suitability as a hunting bullet. Expect excellent accuracy and bullet integrity with PMC-JHP cartridges.

The Hornady XTP design is also a hunting bullet, but these both, the XTP and the PMC versions work as well for defense rounds.

If you got to Ammo :: Ammunition :: Ammo For Sale : Cheap Ammo : Find Ammunition at AmmoSeek.com and look for just JHP premium ammo the site shows this at the very beginning of the list of 9x19 ammo.


United Nations Ammo
Federal 9mm Luger D/H 115 7m22s 9MM 115 Grain FMJHP Hi-Shok manufactured by Federal. Packed 50 rounds to a box and 20 boxes to the case. (1000 Rounds) $595.00 1000 $0.59 [flag]

That's a first class premium ammo that'll get the job done well with a real world documented track record. Yet the price is not near as high as the Starfire.

The fact that Starfire is hard to come by and sticking it to the customers seems to be what I take away from that. Or that is one heck of a typo mistake.
 

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PMC ammunition is just now dribbling into America. The Starfire is another Burczynski design, like the Triton Quick-Shock, and the Hydra-Shok, and the CCI Quik-Shok. It was introduced just before the Black Talon. Funnily, Guns and Ammo featured an article on it, with a full-page picture of it hitting a melon. You could see the cut pieces of melon, al la' Black Talon, exiting the entry point. It would initiate expansion at velocities as low as 500 fps. PMC never truly developed it to his specifications, and it never really caught on. He said that they down-loaded it by approximately 100 fps across the board.

As far as I'm concerned, NO JHP ammo is worth the prices asked today. Look at the price of the Bronze Line JHP in that article/ad, $79.59, or the FMJ at $69.69. Heck, Tula FMJ at $59.59, or Armscorp FMJ at $69.59?
 

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A few years ago, I purchased several boxes of PMC Starfire in 9, 40, and 45. I used it as my primary concealed ammo for quite a while. It always functioned flawlessly in any pistol that I tried it in, including Taurus PT740, PT709, PT640, and PT145 MilPro.

I fires several rounds at gallon milk jugs filled with water, and the expansion was impressive, even when fired from the short barrels.
 

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That is way too much money for any magic rounds....however, aren't these the forbidden "Black Talon" without the moly coating?
 

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I wouldn't pay that for those rounds that is crazy. All the ammo test on youtube I watched they didn't even expand might as well just use cheaper FMJ ammo. And cheaper then dirt is a rip off I don't no what kind of dirt they sell but it must have magic fairy dust in it and there shipping is 2 to 3 times higher then normal prices.
 

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The design was developed by a single researcher, the same one who developed Hydra-Shok. Winchester developed the Black Talon, and there was zero cross-pollination of ideas. I mentioned the cutting effect of the Starfire because it was shown, but not commented upon, BEFORE Black Talon, and the disinformation campaign against it, ever started.

One of the members of the old Battle Rifles.com site was an engineer with an interest in ballistics. He tested the Starfire ammunition in a lab-setting, in ordnance gelatin. It DID expand reliably, and was also quite accurate. Amateur use of ballistics gelatin has led to more disinformation than the Brady Bunch. Temperatures, calibration, and other factors weigh heavily into the calculations. Not noting any of the changes invalidates the entire test.

The Las Vegas PD issued Starfire for many years. With good results. Oddly, it was never as expensive as Black Talon, Golden Saber, or Gold Dot ammunition. I guess that, like Black Talon, it's disappearance from the market has enhanced it's value.
 

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NO!! well not to me!
right off the top of my head I can think of no pistol projectile or laoded ammunition that is worth that!
there are just way to many good quality modern design self defense rounds on the market at the crazy price of half what this is selling for.
I would really, really , really feel bad if i bought this stuff and it wouldn't function in my gun, actually i would feel really, really bad if i bought a box of this and it did function in my gun at those prices!
 
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No its not worth it. Like someone else already said- that is just CTD fishing around for a bite.

Believe it or not....the ARE nuts that will order it.
 

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That is way too much money for any magic rounds....however, aren't these the forbidden "Black Talon" without the moly coating?
The latest generation of the dreaded Black Talons (minus the coating) that I am familiar with were under the
brand of "Winchester Ranger T-Series".
 

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I have used Golden Sabers for years, I like the results from several mediums I've tried and they just shoot well out of all of my carry guns. Plus you get 25 not 20 for around $19.00 when I was stocking up on them. Not a bad deal.
 

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Nothing makes them worth that - and from this video not worth more than FMJ...


I'm sure they will expand, However I would look for something a little more proven. Try these instead and wait until they are available at a business that isn't taking advantage of their customers; Winchester Ranger T, PDX1, Hornady Critical Defense, Corbon, etc...
 

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Back in the 90's this was my go-to round. It was one of the first hollowpoint designs that didn't clog up the cavity and fail to expand. You could buy these for about $8 for a box of 25 or so.....not too bad even for back then.
 
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I had a Gov't Model and a 625-4 Smith back in the '90's that just loved the 230gr Starfire. The 625 was my 'front door gun' (it was big enough to use as a club, shiny enough to look even bigger than it was in low light and threw .45 caliber bullets, what's not to like?) for quite a while and it was loaded with the Starfires. If I remember correctly, it was a follow up design of the Hydra-Shok. All the tests I remember back in the day showed it to be a reliable expander (.80" average expansion with 95% weight retention is what I seem to remember bit I might be wrong) and I know it sure was accurate out of the 2 guns I had that liked it.
 

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My LGS has these in multiple calibers for $20 to $25 a box, depending on caliber. I bought and shot 9mm, .40 and .45 through multiple pistols including a 24/7, PT145, and a gen 1 PT111. Fed and shot well, at least as accurate as I am. I think they're a economical alternative.
 

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First, nobody tests only a single round in gelatin, and draws any conclusion from it. Second, did you happen to notice that there was no calibration mark in the gelatin? That is REQUIRED to guarantee that the gelatin is of a proper density. Then, the gelatin has to remain at a stable temperature, sitting in the sun is guaranteed to ruin it in short order.

As PMC is just now returning to the market, it's possible that the Starfire of current design has been altered by them, in Korea. OR, the fact that it was originally designed to be used in duty-length barrels may have had some effect. The gun was a Kel-Tec PF9, with a 3.1" barrel.

I have some of the older, black box, Starfire. In .380, 9x19, .40 S&W, .44 Magnum, and .45 ACP. It has always functioned, been accurate, and expanded in water and paper media. I, personally, have never gotten into mixing K&K into ballistic blocks.
 

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First, nobody tests only a single round in gelatin, and draws any conclusion from it. Second, did you happen to notice that there was no calibration mark in the gelatin? That is REQUIRED to guarantee that the gelatin is of a proper density. Then, the gelatin has to remain at a stable temperature, sitting in the sun is guaranteed to ruin it in short order.

As PMC is just now returning to the market, it's possible that the Starfire of current design has been altered by them, in Korea. OR, the fact that it was originally designed to be used in duty-length barrels may have had some effect. The gun was a Kel-Tec PF9, with a 3.1" barrel.

I have some of the older, black box, Starfire. In .380, 9x19, .40 S&W, .44 Magnum, and .45 ACP. It has always functioned, been accurate, and expanded in water and paper media. I, personally, have never gotten into mixing K&K into ballistic blocks.
You are absolutely correct regarding the validity of single round tests and the need for calibration (the pistol was a Kahr, but that's not important). I only included this video because I could only attach 1 and I thought it was intersting. But, I found others;TNOUTDOORS9 experienced jacket separation for instance and some others too. I did go on to say that I felt PMC would probably expand. But what I was actually trying to do, was reply to the OP's question; "what makes this ammo worth what CTD is selling it for?" My point was it isn't... at least IMO.

PMC was originally made in the U.S., sold, went bankrupt, was sold again only to now be made in the ROK. I'm not an ROK hater, but given a choice, I'd rather have S.D. ammo made in the U.S. (not that it's all perfect either). I wasn't even suggesting that PMC isn't a viable option for some people. As mentioned, the most important feature of any S.D. ammo is if it is reliable and accurate in the gun it will be used in. But, becuase I can find other well respected and documented ammo made here for at least the same price and probably less (at least as sold by CTD), I would and do choose other ammo and retailers.
 
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