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I own and often shoot a Ruger Old Army black powder revolver which is IMHO, and the opinion of most BP buys, the absolute finest black powder cap and ball revolver ever built. It is a blued gun. Proper cleaning of this gun involves simple dish soap and hot water and, yes, as soon as you get home and followed by gun oil. I've seen what procrastination in cleaning can do to a BP gun thanks to a friend I loaned a Colt Navy replica to once. It weren't pretty.

So, yeah, it's rather obvious to me that this finish damage was done by the black powder. Either sell it or reblue it, but don't blame the gun for firing loads that were never intended to be fired in the gun or for improper cleaning if that's the case.

The finish on my Old Army is fine, but I know how to clean the gun. Even STAINLESS will pit if not properly cleaned of black powder residue, it's that corrosive. It will hold up better/longer of course. The problem with black powder is the sulfur and sulfur gases created on firing. It's like pouring battery acid in the gun if you leave it very long.

I understand you are frustrated at the repair time. I've heard similar, but Taurus is a big company with a LOT of sales. I won't try to make excuses for them, but I try to have patience in such matters. I've never had to send a gun back to them, but if I did, I have other guns to play with so I wouldn't be unarmed without it. I know this, my little Taurus M85UL is the absolute finest little snubby .38 I've ever owned for carry, beats the old M60 Smith hands down (lighter and better DA trigger). Mine's a stainless/alloy gun, but I've had absolutely no finish problems. I have a M66 that's at least 20 years old and aside from all the holster wear, it's fine, too. Neither have seen any black powder loads, of course.

If I had your gun, I'd get it nickeled or hard chromed or perhaps go for one of those fancy polymer finishes I've read about that are supposed to be tough, tough. I forget the finish I was reading about, but I was tempted to send my Kel Tec's slide to 'em (wouldn't be that expensive to do the slide). That thing's finish is getting kinda ragged lookin' with all the holster wear. Guess what, though. My little Taurus stainless revolver shows very little wear. It's all in the material, why I like stainless guns in the first place.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Ya know the whole thing has been a bummer for me and I'm not sure what I will do now.

When I first started looking for a handgun I told my dad I was thinking of getting a Taurus and he laughed and said "Stay away from that junk, just get yourself a good American gun from Smith or Ruger!" But after doing some research it seemed that this was a great gun so I got it anyway, for half the price of my dad's S&W. I felt like I had won! It was indeed a great gun and I was very happy with it. I liked it so much that I also bought a set of $250 CTC laser grips for it! Then this whole incident occurred and I called Taurus just to ask what I should do about it and to my surprise they told me that THEY WOULD FIX IT FOR FREE and to send it on into them ASAP. I thought YES! Dad was wrong! This is a great gun AND A GREAT COMPANY. But as it turned out I ended up getting lied to and screwed around for 4 months and the gun never being repaired as promised by Taurus. Now my dad is laughing and saying I told ya so, "If the gun wasn't crap you shoulda known their service would be. Now go sell that Brazilian piece of junk and get yourself a Smith like I told you to in the first place". :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
*** UPDATE - FINAL CALL TO TAURUS ***

I called Taurus today at 1 pm pacific time.
I got a hold of a man this time. A guy name Richard.
I asked him if he could give me the name and address where I could write a letter to the president of Taurus USA over there in FL.

He ask me why and I said because I want to complain about service on a gun that I had sent to them twice and they had for 4 month and promised to fix but never fixed. He then asked for serial number and put me on hold.

A few minutes later he came back on and said he saw the gun's file and that they had had the gun for 4 months and sent it back twice. He said that he wanted to speak with his manager and see if he could work something out for me. He then told me the president's name is Mr. Morrison and asked for my phone number so he could call me back after talking to his manager.

Ten minutes later the same guy called back and asked me when the gun was purchased and I told him, and he said oh ok, THAT'S the problem. The gun was out of warranty for the finish when you sent it in the first time. But then I told him YEAH I KNOW THAT NOW but I was told by first NADINE and then 2 months later by TALIA that it WOULD BE FIXED, basically I told him the whole story from beginning to end, and how I never asked for it to be fixed under warranty but that it was offered to me.

He put me on hold for a few more minutes and then came back and said that the two women Nadine and Talia that handled my case were no longer employed by Taurus. He said that everything they told me was wrong and telling me to send it to them twice what their mistake and that he apologized for that. He also said that since I live in CA that also restricts just what they could do for me anyway. (not sure what that means)

So I asked if that was all Taurus could do for me now after all these months. And he said yes all we can do is apologize for the inconvenience that our two former employees caused you. And I said, alright then. I asked if I sent a letter to their address to Mr. Morrison if the president would get it, and he said yes. So I said, well thanks for your time and the clarification, and he said again sir we do apologize for the mix up but unfortunately that's all we can do for you. And I said "Ok thanks. Have a nice day", and he replied, "You too sir".
 

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Namerakis,

Ok, it seems to me that you really have two choices. It also seems that you are a bit torn because you like the revolver. So, you can either a. sell the gun at a major loss. Where most likely the next owner will have it refinished or use it as a beater. The next option would be to keep it and have it refinished buy a proper gunsmith and forget the Taurus warranty.

I asked you this earlier, but did not get an answer. Does your gun shoot well? Does the finish hinder it's performance? This should also help to determine your final decision.

I'd like to give you my little issue with a Taurus product. I recently picked up a PT1911. A wonderful .45 for the money. As many have stated, as well as what I've experienced. The bluing wears a bit easier than I thought. Not after a good cleaning with Hoppe's 9, but it does show wear of a gun that may have been used a little more. I also have a Taurus M94 I just picked up for my wife yesterday. After I spoke with Taurus today, I found out that the gun is over 11 years old. Let me tell you that the bluing on this gun is beautiful (check it out in the gallery). What I may do with the 1911 is void the warranty and have the gun refinished my way, when the time comes. I'm not going to waste time unless there was a major defect with the firearm that could pose a health hazard.

Anyway, think about it and again, good luck.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Thanks to everyone for the input.
And I'm glad my situation has enlightened some folks to what can be expected from Taurus USA.

fairfaxjim561553
Man, that really, really sucks! That thing looks like it was blued with an imitation magic marker. I doubt that anyone there ever even looked at it. How could
anyone who is supposed to be a gunsmith, or even a tech., think you wanted it to look like that? I sure hope my Taurus never needs service - I guess the lifetime
guarantee is that you are guaranteed a lifetime of sending you gun back and forth??? PLease post if you ever do get some resolution from them on this one.

vagabundo94
As Taurus no-doubt knows, it's' difficult and expensive to win a new customer, but it's extremely easy to lose a customer. And once a customer is ticked-off, that
former customer can cause all kinds of havoc. I read once that, on average, a ticked-off customer will convince 7 other people never to become customers of the
offending company. Those 7 will then go on and influence other people, etc., etc., etc. It's an exponentially expanding bad-PR campaign for the company.
BillyT - I can assure you, what you have experienced with Taurus will prevent me from ever becoming one of their customers. And I'll share your experience with
anybody I ever run into (family, friends, fellow shoppers at the gun counter that I see handling a Taurus) that may buy a Taurus.
You can take some comfort in knowing that sharing this experience has cost them money, and will cost them future customers.

HUNTRESS
I don't know much about blackpowder loads, and so I wouldn't think to use them in a Taurus. I think Taurus customer service has probably lost another customer
though, through their dealings with this fellow. One thing personally and recently, that bothered me, was a comment by Taurus that they pay special attention to
assemblying their model 85 and 608's, because they know that these two models are being used by customers for CCW. That implies that Taurus does not pay as much attention to their other models. That turned me off to Taurus, and I used to be one of their biggest fans. That was a crappy way to market their 85's and 608's. All my Taurus products are down the road. They've been replaced by S&W, and Ruger.

94BAMF
Thanks for the info Billy, on Taurus customer service...;)
I would ignore the jackasses in the thread, its obvious who they are..

TheGoodLife
I appreciate the heads up on Taurus's service
I know for certain that I won't be buying a Taurus gun after seeing what has happened, and after reading that others have had the same experience with Taurus.
Apparently, their customer service is not what it should be, and this isn't an isolated instance.
The kind of negative publicity that this generates for Taurus is very good for them, especially if they are able to act on it and make needed changes. If not, too
bad for them.

6clicks
I'll keep it in mind for sure. What a waste of effort and time!

rjm
Posting this link all over the internet is exactly what you should do. I don't own any Taurus firearms, but I know I will think twice before buying one now.

USDefender
Thanks for affirming my choice to go with Smith & Wesson for my wife's carry-piece, Namerakis.

xlntech
When I took my firearms training a few years ago, Taurus was not on the list of the instructor's recommended brands. I plan to buy a wheel gun sometime next year, for what I've seen in this thread, it won't be a Taurus.

russbunny
What a bunch of crooked ****ers. Well...I WAS thinking about getting a taurus...I certainly don't know now.
 

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Just to let everyone know, this guy washed his gun with hand soap and vinegar, which took off the blueing, then tried to lie about how old the gun was being that the finish is only under warranty for one year, but the gun was three years old.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=54052&highlight=taurus

I understand why he could be pissed about the customer service, but he based his expectations of service on a lie to begin with. Simply put, he messed up his gun's finish and it pissed about it and blaming someone else.
 

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WOW!!!! I think this is posted on every gun site on the net.I can understand this situation with The customer service of Taurus but to spend this much time on it. You could have bought some polishing compound and had this Som-bit##h hand buffed to a nice shine by now..............................................
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Bullshit. I never lied about a thing.

This is coming from a guy who posted saying that only a nut would wash a gun in soap and water and then looked like a total fool once people started posting that it's EXACTLY what you wash a gun in that's fired black powder.

BAWAHAHAHAHA You ****ing clean a gun with hand soap, vinegar and water and expect the finish to last? Sorry, but that is the stupidest thing I have heard in a long time. If you want to wash your gun in the dishwasher, buy a Glock.

There are product out there that for cleaning guns. Use them

Go away. I can't even call you a troll. You're just dumb.
I have been shooting black powder for years and every black powder manual I own recommends that hot water and a mild soap be used to clean the gun. I don't know about vinegar but I will look it up. I own the taurus gaucho chambered in 45colt and shoot black powder hand loads and always clean the gun with hot water and dish soap. A comment like that shows you don't know much what you are talking about.
So yeah. Show's what this guy knows and how eager he is to bash people.

I did forgot to mention the couple tablespoons of vinegar I poured into the sink full of soapy water in the beginning, but I never lied about it to anyone. Also a sink full of soapy water (base) would easily neutralize a couple tablespoons of vinegar (acid).

Either way, whether it was the black powder, the soap, the water, the vinegar or whatever, I have always admitted from the beginning that the gun getting deblued was my fault and that all I was pointing out was how Taurus handled the situation.
 

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He is simply a petulant child.

Notice how he takes the time to find all the posts from people who already dislike Taurus and are simply jumping on the bandwagon. This is no different then the when people bring up Glock KB's or whatever.

Every gun maker has issues from time to time but they also get there fair share of wingnuts and this is a classic example.
 

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Are you planning on selling this? If you are happy with it I would just have it re-finished and enjoy it. maybe the blueing was bad or maybe the powder had some ingredient in it that effected the blueing???? At this point it does not matter. As far as Customer service Most places anymore have nothing but nit-wits sitting behind a computer telling them what to tell you and its a FU##ing miracle if they can even barely speak English.......................................................
 

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Let's get one thing straight. Vinegar is very acidic. It can or will cause chemical reactions when it comes in contact with bluing or other unprotected finshes of that nature right away.Bluing is a controlled rusting process. The bluing salts are purged and the coating left behind is what you see.There is a little more than that to the process, but the chemistry is the same regardless.Certain types of acids will react immediately with unprotected finishes There are ways to make bluing deeper or more layered, but there are no dureable finishes that are put over the bluing as a coating. This is left the way it is when the gun is made and then sold. Owners of the early blackpowdered firearms were aware of the highly corrosive nature of black powders as well as the rust potential from water vapor, humidity, or moisture of any kind. They cleaned their firearms immediately after use without fail. Some blackpowders are less so than others, but all retain the ability to corrode.So it behooves the owner of any firearm to familiarize themselves with ammo behavior and learn a little about the chemical reactions that take place during and after firing ammo of any kind that they will put through their firearm. It is their responsibility. Knowledge is power and this just shows that.I would not for example, run a car not made for the new 85 ethonal blends on these since the engine and systems are not designed for that type of fuel. The car engine and other parts involved would be damaged or destroyed.Not finding this stuff out and running the vehicle on the wrong fuel would be considered negligence. GOEX was the common denominator from both Glock Talk and the old Taurus forum. The reply's from another forum look familar. Glock Talk comes to mind. Something like this has been done before using posts ancient from other forums. The same replies or similar ones were used before. One of the 605s is different in one picture than the other. One with laser sight grips and one without. The Keltec forum also had this similar thing happen there too. That is ancient history as well. In other cases of this sort model 66s were introduced as the culprits.Different pictures that could not be the same gun. Glock Talks Membership section to check on this has been disabled. Since the old forum records at Taurusforum.com were terminated any info for what happended there is gone, but then it was model 66's getting blamed for this exact thing. Different pictures that showed the revolver is question were more than likely two different ones. Same thing with GOEX loads. The user name and the GOEX nomenclature come from a You.tube.com video of a guy shooting a Colt Navy revolver using GOEX loads.I'll let the public come to their own conclusions on this one. Not saying anything totally wrong here, but the coincidences are just too convenient somewhat.
 

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I think we've seen enough. We get the idea .. you're unhappy and you got the word out. There's no sense in keeping this going. If your interested in selling it, you have some interested parties, you should PM them.

Otherwise, please let us know if anything else comes of this.
 
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