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Discussion Starter #1
It amazes me that no matter where you go (gun forums ) that when you mention certain gun manufactures bashers come out of the wood work. On a different forum I am a member of one came out that I just had to call out. His posting made no sense to me.
Not to be negative, and I'm certainly not blindly loyal to any brand, but just a word of warning to you...I've purchased 7 Taurus guns, 5 of which have required trips back to the factory. The factory always took a month or two to return, and then usually the gun wasn't fixed. What I've written is just a fact of my experience. Obviously I had no bias against Taurus or I wouldn't have bought so many of them. That said, I no longer buy Taurus. I've only had experience with one Rossi, which belonged to a friend. It broke on us one day at the range. I've not seen or experienced any problems with a variety of S&W or Ruger revolvers. Go with the Rossi if that's what you want, but don't be surprised if when it's all said and done, you've got just as much invested in the Rossi, and you're still looking for a reliable CCW revolver. I'd spend the extra $50-$100 and go with a Smith/Ruger. When you go to a shop and look at guns, most are going to appear and feel like good guns, but it's not appearances that matter. What's going to work, and work over the long run is what matters.
Now if you notice the way he opens up. To me I found that so funny. So in response to that claim I posted this .

It amazes me that if someone has as many problems they claim to have had why would they keep buying the same brand. With that said I would not trust any advise you offer on either buying or not buying any brand.
And of course he countered with

Likewise, it amazes me when someone like yourself is arrogant enough to make a comment like the quote above to an honest statement like mine. A simple answer is that the Taurus guns were what I could afford at the time, and they had some interesting guns. They also generally received good reviews at that time (things seem to have changed in recent years).

With that said, I would think that anyone who could not reason how another person might have to make a certain decision, and then has the nerve to pass judgement on the other...well that person either has the intellect of a young minded boy, or is a dim witted twit. Take your pick...maybe you're both.
Love the way he ended the post . So I had to counter myself .

Lets see 5 bad guns out of 7 hmm looks like you have bad judgment. Even if they were what you could afford at the time. I think after 2 bad guns that were sent off to be fixed and were not then I would have given up. So I don't I am the dimwitted twit nor the intellect of a young minded boy. A mirror should be placed next to your monitor for self viewing.
I know if I were to go to a gas station and after 2 times I got water in the gas no matter how cheap the water was I would not go back. I would not go back 5 out of 7 times. Would you ?
 

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Narrow minded people have narrow minded ways.

Their loss in the "Gun World" is our gain.

They tend to forget there's an entire world outside the U.S. border that uses Taurus firearms for their law enforcement and military members with good results.

When you compare a WWII Japanese Arisaka rifle to a U.S. M-1 garand you'll see a world of difference, however the Japanese gave the allies a hell of a fight with their "sub-standard" firearms.

If S&W, SIG, GLOCK, Kimber et. al. are so great, why do they even have customer service repair centers? Even Rolls Royce and Rolex products break....muchadoaboutnothin!
 

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There's a BBQ place five minutes from my house that I loved to frequent. Some 10-12 years ago I got violently ill after dining there and having their potato salad and cole slaw. Haven't been back since.

I usually don't visit other forums unless I am searching information and Google leads me there. Your example is exactly why I found a home here at TA.net. We don't put up with that stuff here. If people want to act like that, there are plenty of other places to spend time.
 

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i would agree....way too many gun snobs on other forums.... this is again why i like this forum so much...........
 

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Well, if he said the 5 guns he had to send back were PT-111 Pro's, I would think he was not telling the truth.
But if he said they were PT-738's I would believe it without a doubt.
 

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FZ is right, argueing with a Moron only in the end makes you look bad to others. I however agree with your assesment of his post.. If I had that much bad luck with one brand I would find something else in that price range, Or save up to buy a more expensive gun. If he didn't have enough money why did he buy 7 in a row (assuming he did) even after sending them off to be fixed, while he was waiting on the bad ones to be fixed he should have saved up his money and switched to another brand. But I have a feeling that he wasn't a "Give your guns some lovin" kinda guy and just didn't take good care of them and probably would have had problems with any brand he chose. Another thing if he was making a suggestion to a "Newbie" like I was when I met you guys, why be so negative..Its not good to start a newbie off with a negative mindset about any gun manufacturer, what if the one he was bashing was the one that would fit them best and what if they had no issues with it like most people. I mean Taurus is better now and their CS is in the top 5 rated by several magazines I have read lately. BTw if Taurus is so bad, then why in Gods name would 6 of my buddies all LEO's go buy new Taurus's after I mentioned all the good reviews I had seen and that almost all of my forum buddies owned several of them without issue... 3 of them bought the PT840, 1 bought a PT92, 1 bought a PT1911, and one bought a PT745 and they all love them, and most of these guys were "Sig Saur" guys...

Note: 3 of those LEO buddies had to send in there "Sigs" for repaires more than once, So with any Product you buy theres always gonna be one instance where you have issues.. I had to send in my Xbox 360 to be replaced 4 times before I got a good one, so I know about bad luck...
 

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I belong to several other gun forums, but feel at home on this one. There's absolutely no sense in trying to put someone down for the brand of firearm they own. I have everything from Hi-point to Colt. Each has its place and purpose.
 

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Not to try to be holier-than-thou, but maybe my own experience will make a point.

I had an epic gun fail. Sent it in for warranty repair and when I took it to the range it showed signs it might fail again in the same way. Reason enough, I think, for most bashers to trot out their frustrations for public airing.

I haven't bothered to put that information on the forum dedicated to that brand and I'll not name the brand or the problem here.

First, it was an anomaly: a failure the likes of which I've never heard of any gun having.

Second, airing a complaint here or elsewhere would serve no useful purpose - especially since I've seen postings by several owners of the same gun who are quite happy with their purchases.

Third, within my extended family we have several other guns bearing that brand name and all have been as reliable as even the pickiest person could want.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
It was not him saying that he had a bad experience with Taurus that got me. It was the 5 out of 7 guns were bad . And he was telling people how stupid they were for owning them. If I kept going back to somewhere that I had that trouble with would it be me that would be stupid ? To me either he is not smart or he was trying to make it sound as if he knew more about Taurus than Taurus owners.
 

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It's actually funny when someone uses their poor judgement to pass judgement on a product. It's like you have to continue to have problems to become an Internet Expert. I've never bought, on separate occasions, anything that I later found to be problematical. If a product was that bad, I simply walked away.

Then again, if I were to have bought a S&W X-frame when they first arrived, I could have had a barrel separation. Then, I could have had barrel problems with an early M&P, or cylinder lock-up issues with a Model 617. Then, I could have bought an early S&W I-Bolt, and had a recall on it, as well. Maybe a S&W Sigma, and had a recall for failing internal parts. S&W also issued a recall for 3rd Generation 9mm, .45, and 10mm pistols with decocking levers. Or the Model 659. If anyone were to make it a point to run out and buy the newest models on the market, independent of manufacturer, they stand a good chance of having problems with virtually ALL of the.

No trouble with Ruger guns? Didn't get a new LCP? Or a new SR9? or a MarkII? The Police Service-Six? The P85? Stainless Mini-14 rifles? The Model 77 Rifle?

All of this mentioned above was the result of recalls by the company mentioned.

I don't know how the individual ever buys a car, as every manufacturer has had multiple safety, or warranty, recalls. Same with most electronics, and anything else that was debuted as a truly new product.

Then again, if the guns were sent in for such major faults as "shoots left", or "won't feed X-ammo", he wasn't looking for help, he was hoping Taurus would grant him a life.
 

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It may be that Taurus is about the heaviest bashed firearm there is, is the reason why we don't bash. I'm not particularly proud of the way Taurus has handled warranties, although I personally have had no problems with Taurus or their products. Ordering parts from Taurus is my main problem. Lifetime warranty or not, after the first year, I would just as soon take a firearm to a good local gunsmith as I can get most repairs done for less than the $60 to mail it in and back, and would have a little better control on the timetable. I would like to order spare parts with a point and click and order more parts that Taurus refuses to sell. That in my opinion is what keeps Taurus from achieving Beretta or Glock standing in the gun world.

In defense of Taurus, they introduce more new models than any other company, and make changes to those models to improve or hit a larger part of the market. This doesn't come without a price, more new models = more bugs initially and slow repair times with only one facility as well as unavailability of parts. So many models, so many generations, so many discontinued models. I understand the resulting problems, and would probably enjoy the Taurus brand more with fewer models, improvements and resulting problems. I have noticed most problems with brand new models and newbie shooters. With new models, an old time shooter can usually do enough tweaking that it doesn't bother him, but getting parts for them may be more difficult than getting parts for discontinued guns.

Anyhow, we don't bash other gun brands very much at all. We do know some Taurus employees do read our posts. We also know a new commitment has been made to improve parts availability and turn around time for repairs. Also, a flurry of many new concepts of guns has not been done in a few years. This has greatly reduced the number of complaints over the past year. Let 4 or five new models come out in the span of a year and you will see complaints take a big spike.
 

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I own a variety of firearms, High Point, KelTec, Bersa, Walther, Nagant, and Taurus among others. They are all simply machines made to a price point. They all succeed at what they were designed to do and since they all 'could' fail at some point they have warranty or service procedures established. Plus many websites should I wish to learn how to repair them myself.

there are NO 100% guaranteed not to fail firearms (or anything else for that matter). I fully appreciate that it is human nature to get ROYALLY P.O.'d when any brand new thing needs warranty repair but it should not be presented as a failure of the manufacturer as a whole. It is also the very nature of internet forums to be used to post the 'bad' stuff that happens much more often than the good.
 
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Bashing really doesn't bother me much because other's opinions are just that. My gunsmith is the only person that has an influence on my gun selection. My last three Taurus revolvers have been flawless, probably because I have him spend about an hour cleaning, polishing, and adjusting before I take it home. Most of the negative replies are really nothing more than BS anyway.
 

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It was not him saying that he had a bad experience with Taurus that got me. It was the 5 out of 7 guns were bad . And he was telling people how stupid they were for owning them. If I kept going back to somewhere that I had that trouble with would it be me that would be stupid ? To me either he is not smart or he was trying to make it sound as if he knew more about Taurus than Taurus owners.
At a guess, I'd think he might have been a troll who - in an effort to really, really convince others - laid it on too thick.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Sad thing is he has been a member on that forum for 12 years but in those 12 years just about 450 posts.
 

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I think that some folks are just born with the "Bashing Chromosome".
They exist not just in gun forums, but in other forums as well, such as boats, sports, cars, etc.
Rumor has it, they may even live in our neighborhoods! :eek:
 

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I browse the other forums to look for taurus bashers when I need a good laugh. Most of their posts seem to be by those who never owned a taurus,only repeating heresay from their buddies. I always return here for a wealth of information from REAL taurus owners.
 

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People who act like that towards Taurus (or their least favorite brand), are like those who argue for CC over OC*. They are so convinced they are right, and act self righteous toward anyone who feels the opposite of their opinion. I own a Ruger, and only two Tauri (so far), and all have performed flawlessly. I am getting ready to purchase a PT145, despite the problems people have posted on this forum. From what I have seen, every gun (car, truck, toaster, blender, etc) has issues. The people on this forum, have shown me Taurus makes good products, and stands behind them.

*For the record, I am not bashing CC. If that is what you prefer, good on you, as long as you carry:D
 

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It may be that Taurus is about the heaviest bashed firearm there is, is the reason why we don't bash. I'm not particularly proud of the way Taurus has handled warranties, although I personally have had no problems with Taurus or their products. Ordering parts from Taurus is my main problem. Lifetime warranty or not, after the first year, I would just as soon take a firearm to a good local gunsmith as I can get most repairs done for less than the $60 to mail it in and back, and would have a little better control on the timetable. I would like to order spare parts with a point and click and order more parts that Taurus refuses to sell. That in my opinion is what keeps Taurus from achieving Beretta or Glock standing in the gun world.

In defense of Taurus, they introduce more new models than any other company, and make changes to those models to improve or hit a larger part of the market. This doesn't come without a price, more new models = more bugs initially and slow repair times with only one facility as well as unavailability of parts. So many models, so many generations, so many discontinued models. I understand the resulting problems, and would probably enjoy the Taurus brand more with fewer models, improvements and resulting problems. I have noticed most problems with brand new models and newbie shooters. With new models, an old time shooter can usually do enough tweaking that it doesn't bother him, but getting parts for them may be more difficult than getting parts for discontinued guns.

Anyhow, we don't bash other gun brands very much at all. We do know some Taurus employees do read our posts. We also know a new commitment has been made to improve parts availability and turn around time for repairs. Also, a flurry of many new concepts of guns has not been done in a few years. This has greatly reduced the number of complaints over the past year. Let 4 or five new models come out in the span of a year and you will see complaints take a big spike.
Jake, I suggest you purchase a Hi-Point before passing judgement on the Taurus brand as the bottom of the totem pole. hehe I own a Hi-Point .45 and that is the most reviled brand on the planet. The Hi-Point .45 is perhaps the most reliable semi-auto I have EVER owned as well... Go to the Glock forum and mention Taurus and Hi-Point and look for reactions hehe
 
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