[chirodoc]

Hey folks,

I got a 709 slim last week and cleaned it and took my CCW class and passed but had a failure to feed on the last round of the mag on the first set of shots. OK, so it needs breakin. So I went shooting yesterday and I am really frustrated. The gun fails to keep the slide open after the last round on several occasions. So I took the magazine out and found out that the yellow follower can easily rock backwards when the last round is out. If it tips backwards so the leading edge is tilted upwards, the follower will miss the tab that pushes up on the slide lock. If this happens the slide runs forward like there is another round to shoot and you end up dry firing if you haven't counted your shots. I tried with both mags and have recreated the problem tiime and time again while cycling the rounds out of the magazine manually.

Took apart the magazines and cleaned and lightly lubed and there was no change. Tried to flip the spring and no improvement. I think these magazines are really cheap junk and may be causing many of the problems that some people have with these guns.

So, is there any known issue with the magazines? Any other changes to try? I really do not think I can ever feel that I can trust this gun as a defensive weapon the way it is now and don't know if bothering to send it back will benefit me. I really don't want to sell it because I know I will take a hard hit money wise and I really do love how the gun feels in my hand and the features it offers and how it shoots when it is working well.

What do you suggest?

PS I took a few pics of the magazine with the follower tilted if that would help I will find a way to upload them.

 

[monty]

Frustrating for sure. You already pointed out break it in so I hate to repeat it but this happened for a while with my GF's 709 as well. However, this past Sunday while at the range it locked open every time. I myself as an engineer am not a fan of issues that just suddenly correct themselves but she went through nearly 10 mags that day and it stayed open every time.

 

[HD-Mike]

Taurus is not known for quality in their magazines, but mine has never had this problem. True, it may look like a magazine problem, but it very easily could be the little tab that is causing the problem - out of position, or bent. It sounds like a simple fix for Taurus. Since the gun is new and under six months from purchase, you can call customer service and explain the problem. They should offer to send you a Fed-Ex label or arrange for them to pick up the gun after you package it for shipment. If they don't, insist that they do pay for the shipping. They will get it right and send it back to you. I know no one wants to send their gun in for service, but that is what the life time warranty is for. Now on your decision to trust the gun as a defensive weapon, if the slide doesn't lock open after the last round really doesn't have any effect on the gun being good for self defense. That is for you to decide. I love my 709 and trust my life with it.

 

[Lommerse33]

I've got 3 mags for my 709. One has a follower that doesn't always lift the slide catch correctly. It's a little irritating, but I've lived with it for a couple years. Contact Taurus. Maybe they can send you a couple of followers?

 

[GreenWolf70]

Whoa, Doc slow the buggy down....you took a CCW class with a pistol that you had not fired, or broken in, and now you are talking about not trusting that gun? I am guessing you have one of the new FS series that only come with one magazine? Continue the break-in process. When you have over 200 rounds through the pistol and it is still doing that, then call Taurus CS and ask for a mag swap. In the meantime, buy at least one more mag and see if it has the same issue. You will need more than one mag for your pistol in any case for a backup, just be sure to mark them so you will know which one is the problem if any of them start having issues.

I would also get some snap caps and spend a few hours here and there dry firing. If you intend to EDC with any pistol, you should make sure you know it inside and out. I usually spend a little time with with a buffing point on my Dremel to make sure everything is nice and smooth. If I'm going to trust my life with anything, it is not going to be a "just grab something out of the box and go" experience for me. And I really don't care if it is a custom made whatever, to me that is usually a recipe for disaster.

 

[chirodoc]

Whoa, Doc slow the buggy down....you took a CCW class with a pistol that you had not fired, or broken in, and now you are talking about not trusting that gun? I am guessing you have one of the new FS series that only come with one magazine? Continue the break-in process. When you have over 200 rounds through the pistol and it is still doing that, then call Taurus CS and ask for a mag swap. In the meantime, buy at least one more mag and see if it has the same issue. You will need more than one mag for your pistol in any case for a backup, just be sure to mark them so you will know which one is the problem if any of them start having issues.

I would also get some snap caps and spend a few hours here and there dry firing. If you intend to EDC with any pistol, you should make sure you know it inside and out. I usually spend a little time with with a buffing point on my Dremel to make sure everything is nice and smooth. If I'm going to trust my life with anything, it is not going to be a "just grab something out of the box and go" experience for me. And I really don't care if it is a custom made whatever, to me that is usually a recipe for disaster.

Yes I did and was willing to pass off the failure to feed on the gun not being broken in. That was the reason I went to the range to shoot some rounds and continue the breakin. However when every single magazine full failed to actuate the slide lock on the final round with both magazines, it was very very disheartening. I have other semi's and have never ever seen this with thousands of rounds fired. Perhaps it will improve with breakin, but looking at the magazine follower and how loose it fits and how easy it is to rock it out of position with my finger when it is empty I am NOT optimistic that more rounds fired will make that any better.

Certainly in a self defense situation, it is unlikely that I will need to reload, but still having a simple feature like locking the slide on the last round fail does not give me confidence that this is a gun I can count on.

I was posting here hoping that perhaps someone had seen this and that there was a simple fix. I can continue to shoot a few hundred rounds through it but it is very frustrating that every seventh shot there is a gun malfunction, even if it isn't a critical one.

 

[Scott8mm]

What you see is not normal; I have never experienced this on my 709 (2010, two-pin version). You have one of two problems. Either (1) a defective/misassembled magazine or (2) a stuck/rubbing/oversprung slide lock lever. As I recall, you should be able to investigate this by removing he slide/barrel/recoil spring and then watch the interaction of the follower and slide lock lever as you slide an empty magazine into place. The follower should push the lever up with ease every time. Try pushing the lever down (with empty magazine inserted) and then suddenly release it; it should snap right up. Maybe a simple tweak to the slide lock lever will fix your problem. However I suspect the magazine is the culprit; I have never observed follower tilt on my 709. If you don't see any problems by inspection, I think your next step is to get and try a different magazine. If you just have a bad magazine, you shouldn't need to send the whole gun to Miami.

By the way, never use WD-40 on a gun, especially one with plastic parts (it can solvent weld some plastics). Also use only dry lube in magazines. Wet lube (oil) can damage ammo (not common) and it also attracts dust/dirt/combustion debris like a magnet (real common).

 

[chirodoc]

Thanks for that reply. I never use wd-40 on a gun or any precision instrument for that matter. I always use a purpose made gun oil. WD-40 is a great product for many uses but lubrication really isn't one of them. WD stands for water displacement which is what it is really good for. The lever seems free and when the follower comes up positioned properly, it easily activates the slide lock. The strange thing is that both magazines do it. The springs on the magazines for this gun seem incredibly weak. My other semi's springs are significantly stiffer than those on this taurus.

I'll call taurus and see what they can do but the bottom line is that this gun is now for sale. I already committed to purchasing something different. I won't name it because I don't want to be seen as a troll here. I do hope I don't lose too much on this one seeing how I had to pay full retail on it since no one seems to be discounting anything gun related these days.

I am still completely satisfied with the Taurus revolver I have had for several years and unless I have some terrible problem with it I would never let that one go.

 

[Florida651738]

Just as info, both my mags have very stiff springs. ( almost too stiff ). I have to use a loader to get the last two rounds in.

 

[chirodoc]

Just as info, both my mags have very stiff springs. ( almost too stiff ). I have to use a loader to get the last two rounds in.

Good to know. I will call Taurus tomorrow when I have more time. If my mags have weak springs then that could be the problem. If they send me new springs and that solves my problems, I will be a happy camper and keep the gun but..then I'll have to explain the extra to my wife! Seriously, I like a lot about this gun, I just need something I can count on working pretty much 100% of the time. With my Beretta, I cannot load the magazine by hand, it came with a speedloader device that doesn't improve speed but allows me to push down the rounds to make room for the next. With my Taurus, it is very easy to load all 7 rounds in the clip with very little effort at all.

 

[Florida651738]

Yes, I have to use an UpLULA loader. They might just send 2 springs.

 

[Scott8mm]

I had another thought. There is a notch in the slide that catches the slide stop lever to hold the slide aft. Is the notch (or the lever engaging surface) sufficiently angled to create a ramp which forces the lever back down by the rapid forward motion of the slide (vs. stopping the slide)? This might cause enough shock load to tip the slide follower. This would explain why all appears normal when you manually move the parts but the slide stop fails under dynamic load.

 

[HD-Mike]

I had another thought. There is a notch in the slide that catches the slide stop lever to hold the slide aft. Is the notch (or the lever engaging surface) sufficiently angled to create a ramp which forces the lever back down by the rapid forward motion of the slide (vs. stopping the slide)? This might cause enough shock load to tip the slide follower. This would explain why all appears normal when you manually move the parts but the slide stop fails under dynamic load.

This may very well be your problem here, so take a look at this. With an empty magazine installed in the gun, pull the slide back slowly and watch the slide catch lever as you pull the slide past the point of engagement. Does it pop right up? If it does, then it is functioning right. Now when the slide gets to the rearward position, slowly go forward with it and again watch the slide catch when it makes contact with the slide. Does it stay fully up, or want to slide down a little due to the two mating surfaces making contact? If it does move down or tip a little, then I think the problem may be with the two mating surfaces. You may be able to file on the slide a little to get a good surface that will hold the slide catch solidly. This has been reported on TCP models. If you do file the slide, you can apply some Perma Blue to the filed area to restore the blue finish. Heat the area on the slide with a hair dryer for best results when applying the blue. Hope this helps.

 

[JR]

One, strip the gun, and clean everything thoroughly. The preservative that Taurus uses can gum up the action if you continue to fire the gun with it in place. THAT may well be why the gun won't lock back. Also make sure that the striker channel is clean and clear.

I've never had a problem with OEM Taurus magazines in any of my semi-autos. Where does the idea that Taurus uses cheap magazines come from? I've had much more trouble with Colt magazines, and Springfield magazines, than anything Taurus makes.

Greenwolf has a point, shoot the gun in, and see what happens. AFTER it's properly cleaned. With as many 709 pistols as are out there, keep an eye out, and borrow a magazine from another gun, and see if the problem persists. That will give you some information to provide if the gun needs to go back.

 

[Sambuh]

Thanks for that reply. I never use wd-40 on a gun or any precision instrument for that matter. I always use a purpose made gun oil. WD-40 is a great product for many uses but lubrication really isn't one of them. WD stands for water displacement which is what it is really good for. The lever seems free and when the follower comes up positioned properly, it easily activates the slide lock. The strange thing is that both magazines do it. The springs on the magazines for this gun seem incredibly weak. My other semi's springs are significantly stiffer than those on this taurus.

I'll call taurus and see what they can do but the bottom line is that this gun is now for sale. I already committed to purchasing something different. I won't name it because I don't want to be seen as a troll here. I do hope I don't lose too much on this one seeing how I had to pay full retail on it since no one seems to be discounting anything gun related these days.

I am still completely satisfied with the Taurus revolver I have had for several years and unless I have some terrible problem with it I would never let that one go.

I'll take it...