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· Registered
98 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Please bear with me as I have a few questions on Taurus semi autos I would like to have some answers to.

What advantages are found in the "captive recoil spring"?

Is the manual safety something truly useful for the shooter or just a way to get around the issue of hair trigger/accidental discharge issues some early Glock users had to explain in court.

Does the 2006 catalog qoute of "engineered for a steady diet of factory new +P ammunition loaded to SAAMI SPEC" mean anythingwhen the manuals say no to +p?

Does the 38 super offer anything 9mm or 45 acp dont offer?

And can I get the black pearl grips in a medium or full frame gun?

· Moderator
33,684 Posts
Let's take this one question at a time. The captive recoil spring combo helps absorb some of the energy thus reducing recoil somewhat and the battering of parts of the gun. This may also assure reliability of the gun in theory.

Manual safeties have several functions and reasons to exist. Even with a heavy DA trigger pull there are certain situations that could cause the trigger to be pulled inadvertantly discharging the firearm. On the draw,especially under duress, people are known to put the finger on the trigger before the fire arm is out in front of the person and pointed at the target or in a safe direction.An object could get caught in the trigger guard with out being noticed and set off the trigger, firing the gun.Sounds fantastic, but it happens frequently. It will not be seen in print or discussed in most instances, embarassing as it is.

When reholstering, putting the gun on safe and then sticking the gun back in also stops negligent discharges. The gun is cocked and light pressure will set the gun off again. Reholstering normally or under stress has caused many an accident with serious injury or death. Trigger fingers are in the trigger guard as the gun goes into the holster and BOOM results. This happens to novices and veterans alike. Then there is the protection from an assailant who grabs your gun to use against you. Happens frequently to police and citizens frequently despite what one might think.

If the pistol is "on safe" and the attacker gets the gun, he has to figure out which button or lever makes the gun"off safe" to function. This gives a victim time to go to plan B and a few seconds to act decisively. This allows one to get the gun back, run, or draw a backup weapon and neutralize the problem, or gain supremacy over the situation again. Depends on the circumstances of the situation.

As for the +P problem, since the catalog says go with +P loads then it is safe as long as certain things are considered. +P is not needed for most defense situations regardless what "conventional wisdom" says. Most standard pressure loads will get the job done with out the added recoil ,muzzle flash, and power regardless of caliber. From short barrels the gain of +P is not that great in power or velocity. The powder expends most of its energy outside the abbreviated barrel burning up. Or not even burning completely. Staying with standard pressure loads within SAAMI specs is a good idea all the way round. The higher pressure loads mean accelerated wear ,tear, and battering of gun parts and frame.

Some minor use of +P for practice purposes and to stay current are reasons to use it. Then carry +P in your firearm in confidence. Especially if the pistol or revolver has a service length barrel. If the manual states a certain bullet weight and velocity for that caliber, then do not go beyond those boundries set in the manual. Otherwise unsafe conditons can cause serious harm to the shooter and firearm, including leading to death. Over pressure ammo is never a good idea. SAAMI sets the rules and the ammo companies and gun makers stick to those rules. +P+ is usually never a good idea. Unless the gun manufacturer gives it's blessing. They know the guns limits. Most guns are strong enough to take some abuse, but why even go over the limits? Severe injury or death are not worth the supposed gain in performance.

THe .38 Super is a neat cartridge, but the theoretical advantage over the 9mm. and .45ACP just are not there unless one reloads for this cartridge. Modern loadings have down graded the velocity due to the older guns out there in this caliber and due to ammo liability. One has to be safe even when reloading. There is the tendency to hotrod this cartridge to dangerous levels. This has happened somewhat in IPSC. There are +P loadings for this cartridge, but are hard to find and the expense can be prohibitive. If one competes in IPSC then there may be a need to have such caliber and gun. Or just because one wants to shoot one. Again expense can take a bite out of the pocket book.

The .38 Super was designed to penetrate the car bodies and criminal's body armor of the times during the 1930's. Other calibers were unable to do this under most circumstances. The last answer to the last question I will have to leave to others. Hope this helps. In the last 5 to 10 years Taurus engineered their guns to take +P ammo use. Use it sparingly and your gun will last longer. Check the pressure levels of each +P or +P+ ammo before using to make sure they are within the set limits. If in doubt, don't shoot that particular load.

· Premium Member
875 Posts
Taurus has been using what is most often refered to as a "dual action" spring system... or a "frame saver". Here is a picture of a similar type from EFKFiredragon Products

Most recoil springs are single springs, but the dual action springs are two springs... the main spring more moderate than the normal spring, and the second (inner) spring is heavier. The intent is to allow the slide to begin to cycle, either under fire or hand cycling, with less tension, and then the inner spring soaks up the recoil tension prior to the slide hitting the frame.

Here are their selling points

  • Impact: The elimination of the slide impacting the frame at high speed preserves the structure of the firearm - and your rather significant investment!
  • Muzzle Control: By changing the final backward movement of the slide from a sudden stop to a progressive stop, muzzle jump is greatly decreased by 40% giving you more control.
  • Function: No interference of ejection port or any feeding problems.
  • Progressive: This is a system designed to reduced the backward motion of the slide in progressive stages after the gun is shot. The effect of this system is that the recoil is reduced by 40% making your follow up shots much easier to shoot. This is a VERY effective system.
  • Stability: Better stability for your barrel. Stainless steel guide rod replaces plastic guide rods for superior barrel support and function.
  • Better Accuracy: Progressively slows down your slide from heavy impact against the frame. Works just like a car shock absorber, reducing the slide impact. Lower impact means less recoil, accurate recovery of the weapon for on-target accuracy is better achieved, shot after shot. Even expert shooters can benefit from lower recoil.
  • Lower Frame Shock: The slide is one of the heaviest components in a semi-automatic pistol. Upon firing, the slide slams back with great energy against the frame. Frame Saver Dual Actions springs can lower this slide impact dramatically, preventing excessive wear, cracked slides and damaged frames, particularly on modern polymer framed pistols such as glocks, Sigmas & HKs.

This is one of the reasons all of us have noted the softer than anticipated recoil on the PT145... this dual action recoil system is really doing the job. It is also the reason that the recoil spring assembly should be replaced as a unit.

There is a confusion generated by Taurus' catalogue and their users manuals. The concensus has been that the revolvers are the most likely target of the +P raiting... and the polymer pistols (actually the grips) are the most vulnerable.

· Registered
98 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the answers, helped clear up some issues Ive been having. Since I got the taurus catalog im not so gung ho on "revolvers only" for osme reason.

The captive recoil spring, does that come in the PT1911? If it was that would be great.

Companies like to say there 1911 spec guns are interchangable with most parts for the 1911 pistol, how much in a taurus 1911 can be swapped out for mil spec 1911 parts?
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