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Morning Joe which I saw when i was surfing toiday was spouting anti-gun BS. Saying that because the background bill didn't pass terroists ANDF ANYONE CAN BUY GUNS WITHOUT A CHECK. Has a person claiming he was a middle east terroist saying in USA anyone can go to a gun show or store and buy a machine gun with no back ground check.
A one sided discussion saying all gun owners are bad and there is no back ground check in the USA.
I almost threw up my coffee so I turned off that channel.
 

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IMHO they stop crime about as well as a truck can stop a train...

 

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If I'm right (and no guarantee of that), there are already plenty of laws already. IMHO, the key thing is once they're in place/on the books, they have to be ENFORCED. For instance, when someone fails a background check, is anything done? I would imagine that, for whatever reason, if you're prohibited from purchasing/owning a firearm, you probably know anyway. If you commit a crime with a firearm, or are found in possession, or try to purchase one anyway, and you're already prohibited, shouldn't you prosecuted for that as well as or including the original charge. Am I making any sense, or just rambling?
 

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ah, no.
 

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I read this and understand what you're saying but a point - how long have guns been made? Guns don't have a experiation date. Guns, generally, don't go bad. Is there a law that prohibits ammo purchase? Guns haven't always been registered when purchased. Wheel guns, 1911 military weapons, rifles, shotguns. Been around for a long time. There are weapons that have never seen a data base. There hasn't always been backgound checks. Am I right on this?

I guess my point is that if you really wanted a gun, it would be easy enough to get without a background check.
 

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I know what you mean i was at gander once when someone failed the check, all they said to him was, "i'm sorry sir, you failed the background check, we cannot sell this to you" and the guy left, they didn't have any indication of what the guy did that caused the check to fail, and didn't do anything else other then help the next person. Not saying that the guy needs to be arrested or anything, but i do think that the system should toss up a flag that will alert local authorities when someone who knows they cant get a firearm, tries to do it anyway.

But then you run into a problem, the store cant safely detain the person until the police can arrive who knows what they might do, so you either do what they did and let them walk, or put a cop in every place that sells guns, and that cant be done. Mistaken identities do happen, i have a friend who has someone else that shares the same name, first and last at least, and was born 1 day off him, in the same hospital, they even have very similar SS numbers, and several times when he went to get something that has come up, that guy cant get firearms, my friend can, if he doesn't put his SS number on the background check form, he gets denied almost every time, but not every time. So i can only imagine that the other guy has probably gotten a approval once or twice because the system spit out the wrong one of the two of them and if he is a person that knows they cant get one, he is very unlikely to put his SS number on the form.

I agree with brazostaurus, i think the biggest issue with the gun laws is enforcement, and possibly the liability of the person that purchased it. Say you bought a gun or two (i know shocking for people on this forum, after all, none of you own those evil black guns i am sure) and your house got broken into, the guns were stolen, are you going to report that to the police, i know i would, and i am sure any other gun owner would as well, if nothing else, you wont get insurance money if you dont.

now my personal opinion is, buying a gun for someone else, and registering that gun in your name is the height of stupidity, even if your getting it for your kid, they have a place on the background check form that covers that, if you sell a gun without a check, and that gun is registered to you, that is just as bad, either way, if the person that is going to receive the gun does not want a background check ran, to me it says they cant pass it and they know it. They may have other reasons, but i wont believe them, that one says it all to me. But if you go ahead and do it anyway, then you share the liability of the person that used the gun you provided to commit a crime, and whatever they are charged with you should get an accessory charge to that, just as if you were with them.

your life long buddy comes running out of a convenience store with a bag full of cash, while you thought the two of you were going fishing or something, and yells at you to floor it, to me, that is the point you get out of the car and run back to the building. if you go with him, well your guilty of the crime just the same.

i dont think that infringes on any rights, and it keeps everything honest. I will never sell a gun that i purchased and required me to get a background check to anyone who wont do the same background check (if nothing else i had to spend the $10, and im petty, you do to) if your not willing to do that, then something is fishy on that deal, and you can find someone else to get a gun from. i wont have the gun i sold you coming back on me after the fact.
 

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If I'm right (and no guarantee of that), there are already plenty of laws already. IMHO, the key thing is once they're in place/on the books, they have to be ENFORCED. For instance, when someone fails a background check, is anything done? I would imagine that, for whatever reason, if you're prohibited from purchasing/owning a firearm, you probably know anyway. If you commit a crime with a firearm, or are found in possession, or try to purchase one anyway, and you're already prohibited, shouldn't you prosecuted for that as well as or including the original charge. Am I making any sense, or just rambling?
You're making sense! :)
 

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No not at all...
 

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I read this and understand what you're saying but a point - how long have guns been made? Guns don't have a experiation date. Guns, generally, don't go bad. Is there a law that prohibits ammo purchase? Guns haven't always been registered when purchased. Wheel guns, 1911 military weapons, rifles, shotguns. Been around for a long time. There are weapons that have never seen a data base. There hasn't always been backgound checks. Am I right on this?

I guess my point is that if you really wanted a gun, it would be easy enough to get without a background check.
Before the GCA of 1968 people could buy firearms right out of the Sears catalog and have them delivered to your door no questions asked.

And if firearms were outlawed people with a CNC machine and a lathe would be making them and bootlegging them just like they did alcohol during the prohibition.
 
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Gun laws are only as good as the enforcement of those laws. Sorry, but I've seen how well the police and courts handle criminals that are caught possessing an illegal gun. I recall reading about the Sandy Hook shooter breaking 41 different laws. Law number 42 would not have stopped him.

Some people are bend on destruction. This is proven by recent events in Boston. Laws restricting people from being able to adequately defend themselves only hurt the innocent.
 

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Guns have always been available. What changed was society so it makes sense
to address the thing that did not change.

So it would make sense to ban pressure cookers in response to a growing Islamic threat.
 

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It's always been my opinion that strict gun laws/restrictions only hurt the average Joe, certainly not the average criminal. Having said that I do believe in Universal Background checks. The reason millions of guns have flooded the streets is because it's easy to just drive out of state or to a gun show and buy off the book guns, then turn around and sell them on the streets. I don't like the idea of "Assault Weapon" bans, or bans on high cap mags. And the numerous bans various states have on things like folding stocks and flash hiders and the like is just absolutely ridiculous. I'd like to see everyone without a violent criminal history, a history of mental illness, and the ability to pass some form of competency test be able to get whatever they want. Is filling out a form and waiting for a computer to say "this guys ok" every time you want to buy or sell a gun a hassle? Yup, but a minor one as I see it, and one I'd gladly embrace if it meant less bans and restrictions.
 

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If strict gun laws worked Chicago would look less like "Escape From New York" and more like "Mayberry RFD"!

Don
 

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I think we can look at Chicago and get the correct answer!!
 

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We can look to Chicago, New York City and Los Angeles for all the answers we need to prove this.

They're the three bastions of hope and security, where all the doors and windows are unlocked while the family sleeps.

And if you believe any of that last sentence, you also think health care is free.
 
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