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Discussion Starter #1
I guess this was an experiment me and my friend were toying with... we were attempting to see how really safe the manual safety is on the PT111 3rd Gen. It is probably not something many people think about but there is a way with this particular DA/SA setup to discharge the weapon indefinitely while the safety is engaged and the trigger being pulled. DO NOT ATTEMPT THIS WITH A LOADED WEAPON... IT COULD FIRE... first the weapon should be in single action mode, then depress the trigger right before the point in which the weapon would fire under normal circumstance... engage the manual safety... release the trigger and you will notice that the trigger attempts to fall back into its normal position but is unable to return all the way... then attempt to fire the weapon UNLOADED... you will hear the firing pin click... if you did this how I did, and used a brand new dry fire cap or snap cap you will notice the fresh indentation of your firing pin on the cap confirming that the weapon did fire although the safety was engaged. This may be typical of all weapons of the DA/SA variety, we have not done the experiment with other DA/SA semi-autos. Has anyone heard of this or know of this particular function of the Millenium series? :???: I WILL SAY THIS ONCE MORE DO NOT TRY TO DO THIS WITH A LOADED WEAPON, YOU MAY GET HURT, AND ALSO RECALL THAT THE SAFETY ON THE PT111 LOCKS THE SLIDE AND A DISCHARGE OF THE WEAPON COULD DAMAGE YOUR FIREARM... :mad:
 

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Discussion Starter #2
if anyone need pictures or video... Ill gladly post some for documentation
 

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I'm not happy about it, but if you read the manual, it IS addressed in there:

http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=5170.0 is a link which addresses that aspect, and to quote from the manual:

"By moving the safety upward you will block the firing
mechanism.

Keep the safety on while not using the pistol.

WARNING: To properly apply the manual safety lever, the
trigger must be in its forward-most position, otherwise the
lever can be moved upwards, but will not be fully engaged.
Keep your finger off the trigger while moving the lever
upward."
 

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Not a problem. I can't see any reason to be pulling the trigger while applying the safety. Is there a solution looking for a problem here? :drool:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
hehe topic 20, probably why i Didn't see it... Haven't read that far back yet... I can see someone doing this on the range or in a live fire situation. I read my manual again, and I don't see any reference to it, can I get a page number? If nothing else, I guess this was a good reminder to newer Taurus owners.
 

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Page, 4, page 19, page 20 I believe have the references.

4. Always keep your finger off the trigger and point the muzzle in a safe direction when turning the safety “on” or “off”.

10. WARNING: Don’t test the safety by pulling the trigger while the safety is on unless you are absolutely sure the firearm is empty and you are pointing away from everyone.

The above is copied from one of the manual for a pistol.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
ok true for any weapon, I did read those two warnings. When I was testing this I was using snap caps so I knew the weapon would not discharging it. I was asking where it said that engaging the safety while the trigger was partially depressed would not make the weapon fully safe... I do understand that rule 4 implies that bad things will happen if you have your finger on the trigger while engaging the safety, I was more interested in finding the caption in the manual that gives a full explanation as to why this is so... I realize this sounds defensive and critical of Robby's post, please don't take it personal, I'm only trying to clarify what I was looking for... Thanks :)
 

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LOL, I never get upset. We are here to try to help each other.

Well here is Page 5 warning from another of the manuals. Just in case you wonder, I have every manual for pistol and revolver that they have on web site downloaded and have read them, But I still miss things or forget them.

WARNING: To properly apply the manual safety lever, the trigger must be in its forward-most position, otherwise the lever can be moved upwards, but will not be fully engaged. (See page 19)

And 19.

Manual Safety Lever
By moving the safety upward you will block the firing
mechanism. Keep the safety on while not using the pistol.
WARNING: To properly apply the manual safety lever, the
trigger must be in its forward-most position, otherwise the
lever can be moved upwards, but will not be fully engaged.
Keep your finger off the trigger while moving the lever
upward.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Ok on page 5 things match up... I must of missed that... on page 19 its a little different... basically its says not to rely completely on any safety mechanism, and then it goes on about child safety, carelessness, and finally about keeping the firearm clean, but nothing on the mechanics of it...
 

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Discussion Starter #12
ok I found it on page 20... so it was in there, just on a different page
 

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I got a million of them. But you can check the Taurus site, and see them. Each seems to be a little difference. Here is another reading from a manual on pistols. again this is page 19 of this particular manual.

USE OF SAFETY
1. Your firearm comes equipped with an effective, well designed safety
device. HOWEVER, NEVER RELY COMPLETELY ON ANY SAFETY
MECHANISM. The best safety mechanism is your own common sense: USE
IT! Always handle your firearm as though you expect the safety NOT to work.
2. While handling any firearm, never allow it to point at any part of your body
or at another person. No harm will result if you obey this rule, even if an
accidental discharge occurs.
3. Leave the safety “on” until you are ready to shoot and the firearm is
pointed at the target.
4. Always keep your finger off the trigger and point the muzzle in a safe
direction when turning the safety “on” or “off”.
5. When applying the safety, be certain to move it fully into position. On some
firearms a red warning dot is located beside the safety; when the safety is fully “on”, the red dot should be completely covered. Always remember, “Halfsafe” is NOT SAFE.
6. Never carry any firearm with a cartridge in the chamber without placing the safety “on”. (The only exceptions are double-action revolvers and some double-action pistols which have automatic internal safeties and which are not equipped with manual safeties.)
7. For maximum safety never carry a firearm with a cartridge in the chamber.
19
 

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Smokewagon said:
Not a problem. I can't see any reason to be pulling the trigger while applying the safety. Is there a solution looking for a problem here? :drool:
Right. I would never attempt to engage the safety while pulling the trigger. That just doesn't make sense and I don't see this as a negative issue in any way.
 

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firemax said:
Right. I would never attempt to engage the safety while pulling the trigger. That just doesn't make sense and I don't see this as a negative issue in any way.
I think the problem is not so much that someone would intentionally pull the trigger, rather that something could become lodged in such a way that the trigger is partially depressed while appearing to be fully released. The kicker is that the only way to test whether the safety is truly engaged is...by applying pressure to the trigger.
 
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