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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
"A jury found Amber Guyger guilty of murder Tuesday for the killing of Botham Jean in September of last year.

The former Dallas police officer now faces 5 to 99 years in prison. Applause could be heard from the audience and Jean’s family could be seen in tears after the verdict was announced.

The jury deliberated Monday afternoon and Tuesday morning over whether Guyger was guilty of murder or manslaughter when she shot her upstairs neighbor on Sept. 6, 2018. Guyger was still in uniform when she fatally shot Jean, and had just ended her shift when she returned to the apartment complex where they both lived in Dallas."

I think that conclusion became clear with some of the additional information revealed in the trial, particularly that she was aware someone was in the apartment before she entered, and that she had been explicitly instructed not to enter a locale in that situation, but to call for back-up.

If she had called for back-up as instructed, she would have realized she was at the wrong apartment...at least by the time the responding back-up had played, "We're here, where are you?"

Deciding not to follow police procedure was not a "tragic mistake."
 

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Congrtulations to the jury on this one.
Amber Guyger did a very stupid thing, and has been properly rewarded for her actions. May she get the maximum possible sentence. It would serve her right.
 

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She shot a guy in his own home. What did you expect?
 

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This is one of those times when we are on privy to everything that the jury heard, nor were they privy to everything that the public heard during the time in which they were being sequestered.

The jury had to pass judgement on the facts presented in the courtroom and I respect their decision as such. Not saying that I agree with it or disagree with it, but I do commend them for serving under what must have been very trying circumstances both personal, and emotional.
 

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That would have been a tough jury to be on...what did it for me however was the red doormat in front of the door. Did she think that the intruder wanted to feel welcome and at home? sheesh.
 
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Discussion Starter #6
This is one of those times when we are on privy to everything that the jury heard, nor were they privy to everything that the public heard during the time in which they were being sequestered.

The jury had to pass judgement on the facts presented in the courtroom and I respect their decision as such. Not saying that I agree with it or disagree with it, but I do commend them for serving under what must have been very trying circumstances both personal, and emotional.
Actually, this is a time that we were privy to everything that the jury heard (and actually more, because the jury wasn't in the court room for everything). The trial was carried live in the news. And it was a short trial, easy to follow.
 

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Without a motive, I can't agree on murder, but she does deserve the maximum allowed for negligent homicide. Dallas already had her on the gurney, ready for the injection. The racial mood in dallas is vicious, and regardless of jury findings, I expected demonstrations and riots with looting. That's still more than a possibility, regardless of sentence.
 

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Without a motive, I can't agree on murder, but she does deserve the maximum allowed for negligent homicide. Dallas already had her on the gurney, ready for the injection. The racial mood in dallas is vicious, and regardless of jury findings, I expected demonstrations and riots with looting. That's still more than a possibility, regardless of sentence.
I agree it's a tough one for me to come to grips on. First and foremost she took an innocent life and has to pay the price. On the other hand I don't think anybody believes for one second she had intentions of killing that person with malice. It was a mistake. A really, really bad stupid mistake or series of mistakes. That doesn't get her off the hook by any means but it doesn't make her a murderer either. Sadly for our society the fact that he was black went against her. Personally I think it's obvious her life is forever changed as it should be but a long sentence isn't going to bring that fellow back.
 
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I would have though criminally negligent homicide, not murder. However, I was not in the courtroom nor was I on the jury. And until anyone can come up with a better system of justice, this in the one we have. At least there will be no riots in south Dallas tonight. (I'll prolly get gigged for that one...)
 

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It was not murder.

It was negligent homicide, but not murder.

In her mind, she was shooting an intruder that came towards her. The forensic evidence did not dispute her account of him coming towards her. In her mind, she was in her home and he was coming at her.

Her key card had opened his door. This was due to his locking mechanism not being installed correctly and it would not latch tightly. These locks were near field locks which meant you just put your card on or near the pad and the lock would open.
 

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I agree with the Murder verdict, just looking at some Her previous social media posts shows that She was a ticking time bomb just looking for the opportunity to kill someone.
Quote:
"I wear all black to remind You not to mess with Me, because I'm a already dressed for Your funeral.
Amber Guyger"
"amber:) saved love to laugh
yah I get meh a gun a shovel an gloves if i were you back da **** up and get out of my ******* ***."
"People are so ungrateful.
No one ever thanks Me for having the patience not to kill them."
This is one case where I believe the verdict was just and deserves the maximum sentence.
 

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What legal definition of murder are you using? Just interested.
Intentional, willful homicide is murder under these circumstances.

It's not '1st degree ' murder that get you a needle in the arm. That takes malice and forethought or planning. This is what's called in some places 2nd Degree murder- an intentional death as a result of a series of unplanned events. She didn't enter the wrong house with the intention of killing him but she did mean to take the shots.

It doesn't qualify as Manslaughter because she acted intentionally. Manslaughter is usually more along the lines of unintended death through negligence like drunk driving (2nd degree where there's not a specific vehicular homicide statute) or an act that indirectly causes a death (you knock a guy down in a fight, he hits his head on the way down and dies).
 

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If the victim was unarmed, then by rights, in any such situation, she should have commanded the person to turn around - hands in the air - drop to the knees - and remain so until instructed otherwise. Even though she was already way, way off base and out of her zone of enforcement.

She screwed up so bad it's beyond comprehension why procedures were totally neglected - or ignored. Justice was served - remarkably.
 

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As a former police officer (27 years) I can understand how this could have happened. I'm not excusing her for her actions as she did take an innocent life, but I can remember being so tired after working a double shift I couldn't think straight. I feel the murder conviction was excessive and one of the manslaughter charges more appropriate, but I wasn't on the jury. There was a lot of public sentiment on this one although the jury was sequestered for the whole trial. I just cannot imagine being in her shoes and facing the rest of her life in jail.
 

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I agree with the Murder verdict, just looking at some Her previous social media posts shows that She was a ticking time bomb just looking for the opportunity to kill someone.
Quote:
"I wear all black to remind You not to mess with Me, because I'm a already dressed for Your funeral.
Amber Guyger"
"amber:) saved love to laugh
yah I get meh a gun a shovel an gloves if i were you back da **** up and get out of my ******* ***."
"People are so ungrateful.
No one ever thanks Me for having the patience not to kill them."
This is one case where I believe the verdict was just and deserves the maximum sentence.
This is why it is not a good idea to post speculations as to what you'd do to an intruder on this board nor on others. All it takes is one social media post to enforce a charge of "intent".
 

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When cross examined by the Prosecutor She testified that She intended to kill Her victim, the definition of Murder.
I was actually trying to determine specifically what legal definition of murder he was using, to wit;

TEXAS PENAL CODE
TITLE 5. OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON
CHAPTER 19. CRIMINAL HOMICIDE
A. Murder is committed by intentionally killing another person; or

B. Murder is committed by intentionally hurting another person and doing something so dangerous that it causes that person to die; or

C. Murder is committed when a person commits or attempts to commit a serious crime, and while doing that crime or escaping, doing something so dangerous that it causes another person to die (Felony Murder).



So, legally and specifically speaking, she committed an infraction of TPC, Title 5, Chapter 19, Clause A, and possibly B.
 
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This reminded me of a vacation that my family went on when I was a teenager. My brother had a key for the room and he accidentally got off on the wrong floor. He went to the room he thought it was, put the key in, and he was in.....luckily an empty room. He figured out the error immediately and went back to the elevator and came to the right floor. Turned out, every room that ended in '04' had the same key on every floor, every room that ended in '03' had the same key on every floor, etc. etc. People will go to great lengths to save money, even at the expense of their customers.

What I find hard to believe is that she walked in and still didn't realize she was in the wrong apartment. There had to be a picture, piece of furniture, something, close to the door that would have tipped her off that she was in the wrong place, even if it was nighttime. The fact that she could make it all the way in, not realize her error, and shoot somebody dead, blows me away. No pun intended.
 
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