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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is something I posted to respond to a bunch of people who kept saying we need to a 10 round mag limit on ALL guns.

Somebody tell me why police and other agencies (to include secret service) use high cap magazines for protection but I cant? A few days ago a women who was being robbed shot a guy 5 times. 5 TIMES!!!! having been a cop before, I can tell you seldom is there a one shot one kill scenario. If a person isnt trained (and it cost money to train) they may miss a few shots as well.

So lets do this math. Two people break into your house and/or attempt to rob and/or rape you. You have 10 shots in a magazine. Mutliply that by adrenaline, an elevated heart rate and minimal training (all which making hitting your target or at least vital organs less likely). Average hit rate for trained LEO/Soldiers is 33% so out of 10 shots they may hit 3. Sum up the total and what do you have? Chances are a person will only make 1 shot out of 10 (if that). I wont even get into unless you have a self defense round (most people carry cheap ball ammo) your odds of stopping someone diminishes as well. Also, self defense rounds are expensive. But I guess they will stop and run away or wait for you to reload. Ooops, most people dont plan to have to use there weapon so they only have the one magazine they just expended.

I am noticing that you get nowhere with the 2A discussion. But when you lay out a parable or a scenario, most people start stumbling and have nothing to say. Its like you took there talking points away by making it real life. They seem to think that everybody is a bullseye shooter and therefore 10 rounds should do the job. Im still waiting for someone to tell me what makes 10 the magic number.
 

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There is a line in the sand regarding impediments to my Constitutional rights and that line is drawn around the current laws, regulations and restrictions. Anybody who compromises on further restrictions is a traitor to the United States of America and must be held accountable for their treason. If we allow ourselves to have our rights further restricted in any manner, then they will continue until every right that we have as free men and women in this Republic will be forfeit.
 

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Because if you have magazines that carry more than 10rnds youre going to go kill as many people as your magazines can hold.
 

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Today they want our magazines .............. tomorrow they will want our comicbooks! Then what? I'm keeping my guns and my magazines if I so choose to do so.
 

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well we all know airplanes have been used as weapons,why are they not limiting the number of people to 10.It's a stupid way of making stupid people happy.
Ten people in a B-17 made for a mighty formidable group.
Just sayin'...
 

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The reason for high-cap mags is the reason for the 2nd Amendment: Should we ever need to throw off tyranny, we'll want to come as close as we can to matching the firepower of the opposition.
 

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People who promote bans on magazine capacity are just ignorant. They may be stupid as well, but let's grant for the sake of discussion that they are not. First of all, if you think the idea of high capacity magazines are not needed, would you say that you should only be using weapons that hold one round [i.e. a single shot weapon]? Assuming that under duress, and you can fire one shot at your attacker and stop the attack 100% of the time, what would you say to more than one attacker? Oh, you need a two shot weapon. Now 3, 4, 5 and 6. We are up to standard revolver level. What if one or more of your shots misses? If your hit rate is 50% and you have 5 attackers, you need 10 shots.

Next, does the anti gun crowd expect that all firearms have 100% efficiency? Aren't they ones that believe that assault weapons "spray bullets" all over? Do they know that civilian weapons are semi-automatic and that each round must be fired individually? [Please re-read first paragraph].

The concept of suppressing fire and its use as a tactic did not become possible until we had weapons that had high capacity magazines. Suppressing fire as a tactic rarely has the goal of killing, but keeping the other guy from shooting while the good guys do something else... like load evac helicopters, pull wounded to places of safety etc.

If I happened to unknowingly drive into a part of the city where a riot was in its early stages [no visible fires, only lots of people milling around] and rocks started coming my way, I would do everything I could to drive out of there. If I got stopped and surrounded, the thugs would be having to deal with 30+ rounds of lead coming their way.

Here is what we say to the anti-gun nuts. We never know when we are going to be in a car accident, so we always wear our seat belts. So, since we never know how severe the threat to our lives may be, we always prepare for the worst. Get it now?

Answer: They will never get it. Sadly, they will expect us to save their sorry arses when the SHTF.
 

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8 cops COMPLETELY missed Platt, in Miami, 40x from 5 yds and less. IIn the Diallo incident, 4 NYPD cops, and diallo had a WALLET, not a gun, missed Diallo 19x out of 41 tries, all at 5 yds and less, some at mere feet of range, and they got ONE solid hit, out of all those rds. Now if YOU are the one who is outnumbered, and you ARE being shot at, and the guys AINT restricted to using one arm (as Platt was, due to a wound) just how many rds might you need, hmm?
 

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I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what makes 10 the magic number.
I have a feeling you'll be waiting a while. Cuomo is attempting to pass a law to make the magic number 7 in New York. Give them a few more years and it may be 4 or 5. Before you know it we'll all be relegated to flintlocks and blunderbusses.
 

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We are dealing with people that are irrational, illogical, and ignorant of legitimate defensive gun use.

Their firearm education is a combination of watching "The Matrix" and playing "Call of Duty". They truly believe that this makes them an expert. In most of those games if you even graze the enemy they are stopped cold.

They believe the talking heads of main stream media that say defensive gun use is rare even though on the internet we have websites that compile multiple instances of lawful defensive gun use every day. More often than not the good guy prevails and is able to either stop the bad guy by shooting him or the mere sight of a gun causes the bad guy to flee.

These people are the type that because they feel this way, everyone else is wrong and must give up their rights.

They feel 30 round magazines are bad even though their usage in crime is very much a non-statistic. They will not let facts get in the way of their feelings.

As they start to ban things and another shooting happens, they will gladly ban more and more gun types until it is no longer legal to own any firearms and the law abiding are disarmed.

Then, when the bad guys are still shooting people, they will wring their hands and still refuse to blame the bad guys. It will always be the fault of the gun.

As Michael Savage said, "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder"
 

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What many are overlooking is that most of the liberal politicians and media know and understand the need for large capacity magazines, they just don't care. They want our guns and they will chip away little by little until we are either disarmed or it is just too expensive to own a gun. High capacity magazines are just the latest "in" thing to demonize.

Facts do not matter, they play on emotions. If facts matter then they would be talking about the violence in Chicago, Detroit and other big cities. But just another story on gang violence will not generate the emotion of shooting children. Last summer Mayor Emanuel's solution to children being killed in the streets of Chicago was to make a public plea for the gang bangers to please step out from behind the children when they shot each other.

Remember this?

“We’ve got two gangbangers, one standing next to a kid,” Mr. Emanuel explained. “Get away from that kid. Take your stuff away to the alley. Don’t touch the children of the city of Chicago. Don’t get near them.”

“And it is about values,” the mayor explained. “As I said then [when a 7-year-old girl was fatally shot last month], who raised you? How were you raised? And I don’t buy this case where people say they don’t have values. They do have values. They have the wrong values. Don’t come near the kids — don’t touch them.”

Back then it was about values, not the guns, not the capicity of the magazines, not hollow points, but the values of those pulling the trigger.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I've had responses that say our soldiers need better training to if you can't do it in 10 shots you need to give it up. Now I know this is coming from people who are being purely political. It's a left vs. right issue with them. But it's made me think more about why I feel the way do. For me it's a self defense issue (along with 2a). Fact is nobody is a 100% bullseye shooter during a gunfight. NO ONE. Just like seldom does a guy go down after one punch. And even though I'm 6'0 230, there are guys bigger me. They don't really concern me. It's the big guys that are high on meth that do or the young thug who is trying to make a name for himself. The young thing normally gets high so he has the nerves to do the deed. So if I'm facing a guy on meth and don't get a head or heart shot, 10 rounds may not be enough. If I'm facing two people and protecting my family, I may have to use some suppressive fire (baring there are no bystanders).

My point is no one on the anti-gun side seems to want to discuss a self defense scenario. I could understand if the focus was to get rid of handguns which is the most often used murder weapon. But it's a focus on something that is seldom used! And then there is no plan to deal with the illegal weapons. Those are the people I'm trying to protect myself one but you want me, a soldier and former cop to be out gunned and possibly outmanned? Makes no sense!
 

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Today they want our magazines .............. tomorrow they will want our comicbooks! Then what? I'm keeping my guns and my magazines if I so choose to do so.
No please tell me that they won't come and take my comic books, they are the only humor left in this waco liberal leaning forest of deadwood. :)
 

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The problem is, as Piers Morgan so eloquently points out, "assault rifles" are being used in all the rampage mass shootings. So if "assault rifles" and hi cap mags are banned our children and moviegoers will be safe.
Because a pistol and a few politically correct 10rnd mags wont have just as easy a time killing 20 children as an AR would. Or a guy with two pistols and some 10rnd mags wouldnt have just as easy as a time shooting up a theater.
 

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Anyone who uses "supressive fire" during any gun fight or protecting their life, family, or property is wasting ammunition. Remember, you are not in a combat area but an area in which you are responsible for every one of your fired bullets. You wound or kill someone innocent, and you will pay the price both civilly and quite possibly, criminally. Quite frankly, I believe limiting magazine capacity is a band-aid remedy to a non-problem. If any of you, who carry a handgun (revolver or semi-automatic), are not carrying a second magazine or speed loader, you not not being tactically wise.

I recall a bank robbery one cool afternoon in Houston where the robber carried two handguns tied by lanyards to his wrists. After wounding one police officer and grabbing a bank teller as a hostage, he was untimately fatally wounded by a uniformed police officer with a revolver, who managed to get up within 15 feet of the suspect and shoot him in the back of the head. I was in charge of two other Homicide Division Crime Scene Unit investigators during the ensuing scene investigation, I found hundreds of bullets in both magazines and speed loaders in his jacket. None were very high capacity carriers, but yet, he did a tremendous amount of shooting within the 10 minutes the fight occurred.

Learn to use at least one spare reloading device. Also, most of the time, thugs we meet on the street or in your houses at 3 AM usually don't hang around after the first gunshot is fired. Most are cowards and fear being shot more than you.
 

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