[Funshooter]

I've seen quite a few mentions of the .380 acp as a defense or ccw weapon and thought this link may be helpful to some. Some of the expansion data surprised me.
http://www.geocities.com/bersa_thunder/cartridges.html

 

[JSir]

I've been thinging about getting a Bersa .380 since it would be the smallest of my CC guns. I have heard mixed reviews. Anyone actually have one they can give hands on notes about? Nice info on the expansion!

 

[Funshooter]

JSir, I've owned a couple of the older style Bersa's and they were good shooters. Fed most JHPs that I tried. I prefer the KBI because it fit me better, but I don't know if you can find one in your area. Nowdays, you can get a 9mm the same size or a little smaller.

 

[JSir]

I like the look, fits well in my hands, and the price is right. I just want to be careful about something that my or my families lives may depend on.

 

[thunderjohn]

I've had several Bersas in all calibers. ( 380, 9, 40 & 45) Never a problem. Nice shooters and a well kept secret until recently. the prices on used ones have started to climb. I have no problem with the 380 caliber, especially with today's ammo choices. Others disagree.

 

[Jkwas]

The Bersa was high on my aquisition list until just recently. They have a good reputation as being a solid gun at a good price point. I got the chance to look at one close up and field strip it the other week with the idea I might buy one. I looked at the Sig 232 at the same time. Now, it's unfair to compare a $270 pistol to a $550 pistol for overall quality and appearance and I really wasn't trying to. But even if that Sig wasn't there I would still have to say the Bersa was quite rough in finish and crudely built. Probably worth the money but I was looking for something a little nicer. The trigger was nothing to write home about either.
IMO, if you go .380 then you might as well go Keltec or Ruger and use it for pocket carry. The Bersa is about the same size as the Millenium guns and not as nicely put together. A much better buy for a little more money, and 9mm and higher capacity to boot.

 

[gvaldeg1]

If you want something really small and concealable get a Kel-Tec P3AT (only 8.3 ounces empty). Mine makes my 40 cal Taurus PT140 Mil Pro look huge! With Buffalo Bore ammo (I keep 7 rounds of BB Gold Dots in mine at all times), +P 380 ACP, the little Kel-Tec will outperform a snub nose revolver loaded with 38 special +P Gold Dots. Check this out:

http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1202857757

Rather impressive for the 2.7 inch barrel in the KT. It does a little better in the Bersa (1100 fps and 242 ft lbs in the KT but, 1200 fps and 288 ft lbs of energy in the 3.5 inch barrel Bersa). This ammo really makes the 380 a credible defense weapon.

 

[JSir]

Thanks for the info. Does the lack of a safety make you feel "unsafe". or do you feel it will be just like carrying around my revolver?

 

[joe sixpack]

the bersa thunder .380 is a good gun for the money they can be had for 200-225 NIB, maybe even less.

pretty decently built, only come with one mag though.. but they're good size for CC

.38spl/.380acp is kinda the lowest i'd be confident in carrying.

anything smaller is "better then a pointy stick"


the real problem is .380 is kinda expensive for shooting so i dont own any, and most .380's are big enough to fit a 9mm since it's only 2mm longer in length.

so i kinda overlook .380's

 

[gvaldeg1]

Thanks for the info. Does the lack of a safety make you feel "unsafe". or do you feel it will be just like carrying around my revolver?

Exactly...it's just like carrying a double a action revolver. The P3AT's trigger pull if rather light for a double action (about 5 pounds while my 605's double action pull is around 10 pounds) but the pull is fairly long (about 0.5 inch). It takes a deliberate trigger pull to fire it. I carry it in a Uncle Mike's pocket holster and it would be nigh onto impossible to accidentally fire it when holstered. I always have 7 rounds in it (one in the pipe) and feel completely comfortable.

 

[gvaldeg1]

.38spl/.380acp is kinda the lowest i'd be confident in carrying. anything smaller is "better then a pointy stick"

the real problem is .380 is kinda expensive for shooting so i dont own any, and most .380's are big enough to fit a 9mm since it's only 2mm longer in length.

so i kinda overlook .380's

This one really had me scratching my head. I told myself that I wouldn't respond but it was peculiar enough to force me to. Particularly the 9mm bit (sic) "most .380's are big enough to fit a 9mm since it's only 2mm longer in length. so i kinda overlook .380's". I'm really not sure what you're alluding to here. While the 9mm Luger (Parabellum) is 9x19 and the 380 ACP is 9x17 that does, in fact, make the 9mm Luger 2 mm longer. Although they are both 9mm's, the similarity pretty well stops there. The 9x19 is a high pressure cartridge operating at the same SAAMI pressure as the .357 magnum which is 35,000 psi (the +P 9x19 pressure is 38,500 psi) and the 380 ACP operates at the fairly low pressure of 21,500 psi. This requires cases with thicker base designs and much stronger guns for the 9x19. If you were implying that you could take a 380 and make the chamber 2 mm deeper and fire 9x19 rounds that would be a tragic mistake. On the other hand, if you were afraid that if you had a 380 as well as a 9x19 and may get the rounds mixed up that's really no problem. If a 380 round gets in a 9x19 chamber, it probably will seat so deeply it wouldn't fire. Even if it did...it's no problem. It won't hurt the gun. If you try 9x19 rounds in a 380 either they won't go in the magazine or they won't chamber. And as for overlooking 380's...go back and look ar the Buffalo Bore tests that I posted.

 

[PI GUY]

Colt .380 govt in ss here, had since 1985, 100 percent reliable, dead nuts center mass at 7 to 9yrds, very managable for double taps and rapid fire.

 

[joe sixpack]

@gvaldeg1

sorry no i did'nt mean you could just bore out another 2mm and it would fire 9mm.. actually the magazine might not be big enough to take a 9mm anyway..

although thats not to say .380's out there couldn't handle it.. just because .380 is milder then 9mm doesn't mean every .380 out there COULDN'T handle a 9mm.


but what i meant was when you compare .380 and 9mm compacts the sizes are usually pretty close.
the size advantage you'll find carrying a .380 over a 9mm is pretty small so i dont even bother with .380's since i can find a 9mm of similar size and has more stopping power and is cheaper to shoot.

 

[gvaldeg1]

@gvaldeg1

but what i meant was when you compare .380 and 9mm compacts the sizes are usually pretty close.
the size advantage you'll find carrying a .380 over a 9mm is pretty small so i dont even bother with .380's since i can find a 9mm of similar size and has more stopping power and is cheaper to shoot.

Find me a 9mm that weighs 8 ounces and won't blowup and I'll buy it! ;D

 

[joe sixpack]

im not aware of any .380 that weights 8oz let alone a 9mm.
but i dont doubt you, i would however like to know what gun you're talking about.

personally weight is'nt even a consideration i haul around my pt92 and it's 32oz iirc unloaded.. i dont even notice it.

dimensions however does count with me, is a .380 smaller then a 9mm? not always.. sometimes they're bigger then a smaller 9mm.. but in the end a .380 of same design could always beat a 9mm by at least 2mm in length, i dont deny a .380 CAN BE smaller then a 9mm, they just are'nt small enough for me to consider the stoping power loss and increased ammo prices.

if you're looking for the ultimate in small then get a dillinger or one of those single shot pen guns.

 

[gvaldeg1]

im not aware of any .380 that weights 8oz let alone a 9mm.
but i dont doubt you, i would however like to know what gun you're talking about.

personally weight is'nt even a consideration i haul around my pt92 and it's 32oz iirc unloaded.. i dont even notice it.

dimensions however does count with me, is a .380 smaller then a 9mm? not always.. sometimes they're bigger then a smaller 9mm.. but in the end a .380 of same design could always beat a 9mm by at least 2mm in length, i dont deny a .380 CAN BE smaller then a 9mm, they just are'nt small enough for me to consider the stoping power loss and increased ammo prices.

if you're looking for the ultimate in small then get a dillinger or one of those single shot pen guns.

My Kel-Tec P3AT weighs 8.3 ounces empty and 11 ounces loaded with 7 rounds.

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/p3at.html

Apparently you didn't look at the Buffalo Bore tests I posted earlier in this thread. The P3AT load with BB Gold Dots will totally blow the socks off any Derringer (not dillinger as you said...Dillinger was a famous bad guy who was killed outside of the Biograph theater in Chicago where he was "set up" by the notorious "Lady in Red", Anna Sage) or any single shot pen gun. Believe me...the P3AT is smaller than ANY 9mm automatic but still a credible defense weapon. Take the time to look at what I posted above in this thread.

 

[Jkwas]

The P3at is a very successful gun in the marketplace. Down here in South Florida they fly off the shelves. That's why Ruger copied it so closely. Why mess with success?

 

[gvaldeg1]

The P3at is a very successful gun in the marketplace. Down here in South Florida they fly off the shelves. That's why Ruger copied it so closely. Why mess with success?

That's interesting to hear how popular they are in South Florida. Thanks! I really like mine. Even though it "kicks" a bit (because it's so light), it's a lot of fun to shoot. ;D

 

[JSir]

Great info my friends

 

[joe sixpack]

@ gvaldeg1

ah yes im aware of it, ruger is making a gun based off it actually.

no i did'nt know it's weight.. like i said weight is the least important thing with me if i can haul around a 32oz(unloaded) 92 and not know it then any compact is gonna be fine.

again i say.. yes the gun is small.. but not worth the cost, capacity and stopping power loss over a larger 9mm..

im not gonna notice an extra .25 inch width, length i might enjoy but the height is to small.. infact i held one in the shop and my ring and pinky finger was both hanging off it.
dont know what kinda recoil the gun has but im not comfortable carrying a gun im gripping with half a hand.

im really glad this gun works for you, if it was the absolute biggest you could conceal then go for it.. i'll take a little bit bigger gun with more firepower, and larger capacity & enough room for a proper grip.. the size trade off imo is worth it.

oh and most .380's are not that small, there may very well be a 9mm nearly as small as that but it would'nt matter because i would'nt beable to grip it.