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Discussion Starter #1
I purchased a new Taurus 1911 a couple weeks ago.  After getting it home I fired it 8 times at my house just to see how it did.  The gun operated flawlessly.  This weekend I had the opportunity to take it to the range for the first time.  The first round I tried to fire did not extract the empty casing.  I dropped the clip cycled the weapon by hand and it extracts the empty with no problem.  Every round thereafter did the same thing.  Field stripped the gun, cleaned it, same thing.  Continued to try different clips, different ammo, different amount of ammo in clip, even tried firing without the clip.  Always had the same result, weapon does not extract empty casing when fired but will extract all the time when cycled by hand.  Any suggestions?
 

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Almost sounds like a problem with the slide spring being to tight or not broken in. Since cycling by hand works fine it would appear that it is operating normally, just seems to me like a spring issue. I am no expert so others advice may be more helpful. Cycle thqt slide manually a couple houndred times.
 

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Also take a look at the claw of the extractor and make sure it isn't rounded off where it should grab the round. It may still pull the rounds hand cycling, but the brief instant it has to grab and yank that shell out may be too much force on the tip of the extractor to grab it properly.
 

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Forget the pistol, how did you house hold up after being shot 8 times?

And M1's have clips, 1911's have magazines, just saying.

Look at one of the threads on tuning your 1911 extractor, it gives you a good idea of what your extractor should look like and a test on how to tell if there is enough tension in the extractor. Sounds like, as others here have said, the extractor is having a hard time grabbing the rim during firing cycle. Check the extractor claw for chips and/or burrs. Check extractor tension (if it's too loose if would let go too easily). You didn't say what type/make of rounds you were firing, that could be an issue (loads too light, or too hot). And are the cases sticking in the barrel, or only partially coming out, or coming out but jamming? Are there any marks on the case rim from the extractor, or is the extractor pulling through (chipping) the case? Any marks on the walls of the case that might make you think they are sticking in the chamber? More info and some pictures might help others help diagnose your problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have looked at the picture of the extractor in the manual online and I know the extractor in my weapon does not look like that. I don't know if the picture in the manual is generic or if mine is defective. I have only fired the weapon less than 20 times so I don't think it should be a wear problem. It definitely does not have a defined lip all the way from the bottom to the top of the extractor. It does have a well defined hook at the bottom.

The first 8 shots were Remington ammo(these operated correctly). The next 6 were Hornady (didn't work). Tried 2 more Remington again(didn't work). Tried 2 Herters (didn't work). All were bought, no handloads.

I'm still confused about how it worked correctly for the first 8 shots.

Could I have done something incorrectly to cause this while cleaning the gun?

I don't think the casing ever comes completely out of the barrel because the next round tries to push in on top of it.

I did notice that the empty casings are not completely round after the bullet has been fired.

I don't notice any markings on the shell casing where the extractor chipped it as it slid off the casing.

The casings are not stuck in the barrel, they come out relatively easy.

I will post pictures tonight. I don't have the gun with me right now.
 

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Possibly the extractor failed after the eigth round was fired. I must have misunderstood that you fired 8 rounds without failure or malfunction.
 

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When my extractor broke there was just enough of the claw left at the bottom that it would still extract when hand racking the slide but would not extract when shooting. Hey I'm a pro now! :rolleyes: haha
 

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The simple test in that link above will tell a lot. When I got my 2nd PT1911, I was getting stovepipes and other issues. Using that test, the extractor would not hold the round at all. A little tuning and it works fine now.

BTW, you mentioned firing rounds without the mag. I hope you are not dropping the slide on a chambered round. That's a big no-no on a 1911, and a good way to break an extractor.
 

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3 options here.
1. Call Taurus
2. Buy a new extractor and install it yourself
3. Buy a new extractor and have a smith install it.

Personally I would go option 2 with a quality extractor. You had enough sense to remove the extractor yourself so I am assuming you could be mechanicaly inclined enough to install and fine tune it yourself. Completly up to you at this point, like I said though, Id just repair it myself rather than pay someone or send it off, I like doing things myself and I doubt taurus would just send you an extractor, but I could be wrong. And if they did you would still have to wait for it. I am also impatient. :)
 
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After removing the extractor last night, I realized it is obviously broken. What should I do at this point?
Several options!
1) install the extractor back in the gun, contact Taurus for a pickup and return the gun to them for repair.
2) contact Taurus and see if they will send you an extractor and you replace, install and tune the extractor.
3)Order an aftermarket extractor ( some do not work with the Taurus series 80- safety) and install it yourself.
4) take the weapon to a local gunsmith and have him/her install a new extractor in it.
 

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Also - once you get this fixed (& don't despair, it isn't a big deal to change it even if you have a gunsmith do it), make sure the slide never closes under spring pressure without picking up a loaded round or snap cap from the magazine!

I'm not saying you did it, but it is very hard on a conventional 1911 pistol to have the slide slam closed with an empty chamber, or even worse for the extractor, to slam or even gently shut on a chamber with a round or snap cap already in there. The extractor on a PT 1911 is of the "conventional" type - it is internal & is not spring loaded. Some 1911 pistols - the S&W line comes to mind - have external, spring loaded extractors. It isn't as hard on them to be closed on a cartridge already in the chamber & have to snap over the rim as the spring takes most of the pressure. But an internal extractor is more easily damaged when it is snaped over the rim of a cartridge. They are designed in such a way that the rim of the cartridge slides into the hook of the extractor as the slide picks up the cartridge from the magazine.

If you want to see it work, buy a few Snap Caps - DO NOT USE LIVE AMMUNITION! - & load them into a magazine. Point the gun straight upwards, lock the slide back manually, insert the magazine, & then slowly release the slide & allow it move forward under the spring pressure while you contol the speed by holding onto it & look through the ejection port in the slide. You'll see that as the slide moves forward & picks up the top Snap Cap, the rim will slide into the hook of the extractor as it is guided into the chamber. The extractor doesn't "snap" over the rim of the cartridge.

Also, if you want to have the maximum number of rounds in the magazine & a round in the chamber, be sure the slide picks up the round in the chamber then pull the magazine & top it off.

You might already know all of that & if you do - sorry! - but maybe someone else might find it helpful. Good luck with getting the new extractor installed! If it were me, I would buy an extractor & install it or have a gunsmith do it while also calling Taurus & get one (for free) from them. That way you would have a spare.
 

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All good advice, just like to add that due to the lightbulb-like nature of the 1911 extractor, it would be good advice to order a spare extractor to tune and keep on hand if the extractor goes out again. This is good advice for ANY 1911 owner. My understanding is the Taurus extractors are dirt cheap.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Stayed on hold with Taurus CS FOREVER!!!!!!! Left a message, haven't heard back. Ordered some parts from MidwayUSA. Be back at the range soon....and a little smarter when I get there. Thanks to everyone for the help. It was greatly appreciated.
 

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Whenever I get stuck on hold for a long time I am so grateful for the modern technology of the hold and speakerphone buttons. Saves the old neck cramp.

This is all a good reminder, once again, for me to get off the dime and buy my backup extractor...with over 7,000 rounds that "light bulb" is bound to go out sooner than later.
 

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Everyone here is more than happy to help. Glad you will be getting it up and shooting sooner rather than later.

Agreed, biker, I just ordered an extractor and some various other parts as well.
 

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1911 Auto Extractor AdjustmentBy Jack Weigand
The extractor on a 1911 Auto Pistol is one of the most misunderstood parts of the entire gun. It probably causes more malfunctions and more jams than any other part, including the magazine. I am going to explain what it does, how it works and how I make simple extractor adjustments in my shop.

I am going to make a bold statement and then of course explain myself. The extractor has one function and one function only. That is to hold on to the spent case long enough for the slide to move rearward until the case hits the ejector. The case then pivots around the extractor head and is released out of the ejection port of the slide.

1911 Auto Breechface Detail

Some gunsmiths share the opinion that the extractor guides the case into the chamber, but in my experience, this is not necessarily true and here’s how to prove that. Remove the extractor from a 1911 Auto, insert a magazine filled with dummy rounds. Rack the slide and feed a dummy round from the magazine into the chamber. You will find the pistol will feed reliably without an extractor.
Extractor Head as viewed from the end of the breechface

Early in my career as a pistolsmith I used to remove the extractor in diagnosing extractor type problems. If the pistol fed OK with the extractor removed then I would go to work on the extractor because I was pretty sure that it was the problem. You will find, generally speaking, that if you follow the directions I’ve outlined here in fitting and adjusting the extractor, you will avoid almost all of those diagnostic problems and save the time spent doing them.

HOW IT’S MADE
For the most part, high quality 1911 Auto extractors are machined from bar stock and heat-treated. From manufacturer to manufacturer you will find different materials used but generally speaking they all hold up very well. Extractors are machined from both carbon steel and stainless steel. I would avoid extractors that are cast. If you encounter an extractor that will not maintain correct tension, my suggestion is to replace it with a new one with the correct temper.
View B


HOW IT WORKS
As the pistol cycles after firing, a fresh round is stripped from the magazine by the slide as it comes forward. The bullet nose travels up the feed ramp and is cammed into the chamber. As the cartridge is camming, at about the 45-degree mark, the rim encounters the extractor. The rim of the cartridge is fed into the extractor hook and then it is cammed outward as the bullet is chambered.

Now, take a look at the Breechface Detail shown above. This is a simple CAD drawing but you will get the idea. At the point in the loading cycle we described above, the cartridge head is held against the fixed portion of the breech face. You can see the extractor tunnel in the diagram, where the extractor is positioned.
Extractor tension gauge​
The extractor is exerting side pressure toward the fixed portion of the breech face. This is where the term extractor tension comes from. Extractor tension is simply the amount of pressure being exerted by the extractor on the case head. 25 to 28 ounces of tension is a good working range for most semi-auto pistols.

As the pistol is fired, the case is held firmly against the breech face until it moves far enough in the cycle to come in contact with the extractor. The case is then pivoted around the extractor by the ejector until it releases and is ejected from the pistol. If the case is not held firmly by the extractor you will experience erratic ejection performance or non-ejection.


RCBS Trigger Pull Gauge​


FAILURE TO FEED
In most instances, an extractor that is adjusted too tightly (too much extractor tension) will cause a failure to feed. In this condition, the case head is not allowed to travel up, into the breech face because the rim of the cartridge never becomes fully-seated under the extractor hook.

Excessive extractor tension can also cause the extractor to dig into the cartridge rim, which is made of brass. This will cause inconsistent feeding or an intermittent feeding problem.

Refer to View “A”. This illustration shows the end of the extractor as if you were looking at the breech face from the muzzle end but it shows the extractor hook only. You will see on the left what the majority of extractor hooks are machined like. We want to radius the lower portion of the hook as shown in the illustration on the right. This area, when left with a sharp transition, can dig into brass and impede feeding.

The second problem area, View “B” is a view of the extractor from the same vantage point with the hook removed. You will see a small bevel where the case slides up the extractor face that usually has a sharp intersection. I take a small needle file and radius this intersection to smooth up the transition point.

When examining your brass you will find small dings on the rim of your brass, this is the area of the extractor that causes it. Similarly with the hook not being radiused you will find small dings in the web of your brass.

FAILURE TO EXTRACT
Failures to extract are usually related to an extractor with too little tension. With too little tension, the brass is not held securely long enough in the cycle to be properly ejected. The brass is allowed to loosely float around as the pistol cycles. The brass hits the ejector in a non-uniform manner and ejection is very random. One case may be tossed several feet, another case may just barely clear the edge of the ejection port.

CHECKING AND SETTING EXTRACTOR TENSION
Many highly trained pistolsmiths can adjust extractors by hand with a great deal of success. In my shop we try to employ a method that is a little more scientific by identifying our unknowns. I try to use procedures that produce consistent results. I like results that can be measured (quantified) and later incorporated into other pistols I intend to build in the future. This saves time for us and frustration for the customer. Return shipping is quite expensive these days and customer returns are something I try to avoid at all costs.
Extractor Tensioning Tool

I determine extractor tension using our Extractor Tension Gauge Set (#957-101-000). The Set includes two, double-ended, brass gauges that will work for 9mm/.38 Super, and .40 S&W/.45 ACP. To use this tool you will also need a trigger pull gauge that reads in ounces. I recommend the RCBS Trigger Pull Gauge (#747-094-500). That’s the trigger pull gauge that I use in our shop and it works just fine. If you really want to go upscale, Brownells offers four models of Recording Trigger Pull Gauges that will not only show exact extractor tension but record the tension with a telltale. The 6 lb. Model (#174-006-060) will work best for measuring extractors.

First, install the extractor into the slide and retain the extractor with the firing pin stop. Clamp the slide vertically in a padded bench vise with the muzzle end pointing upward and the ejection port facing you as you stand in front of the vise.

Insert the Extractor Tension Gauge for the appropriate caliber between the extractor and the breech face directly where the case head would set. Line up the hole in the gauge with the firing pin hole. Attach a trigger pull gauge to the opposite end of the Extractor Tension Gauge. Pull the trigger pull gauge toward you so the Extractor Tension Gauge will be moved from between the extractor and the breech face. Read the tension on the scale at the moment the Extractor Tension Gauge begins to move toward you. The amount of pull required to move the Extractor Tension Gauge, expressed in ounces, is your extractor tension. Ideally, the tension should be between 25 to 28 ounces.

To adjust the amount of tension exerted by the extractor, you can bend the body of the extractor to position the hook closer or farther away from the side of the breechface. It can be bent using many methods. You can use the extractor tunnel hole in the slide to capture half of the extractor while you bend it with your hands. You can also bend it with two pairs of pliers or secure one end of the extractor in a vise.

Over the years I had problems controlling the amount of bend when adjusting extractors by any of these methods. I would go through the bend and unbend method several times until I got it just right. I was quite time consuming.

I developed a new tool. It’s called the Extractor Tensioning Tool (#957-000-037). It’s simply a hand arbor press used to precisely bend the extractor while controlling the degree of bend.

The picture above shows the Extractor Tensioning Tool with a 1911 Auto extractor setting in the tool. If your extractor has an insufficient amount of tension follow these directions. Adjust the Stop Screw and Lock Nut until there’s an 1/8" of gap between the extractor and the tip of the Stop Screw. Tighten the Thumb Knob on the bottom of the tool until the extractor rests against the end of the Stop Screw. Tightening the Thumb Screw bends the extractor body.

Reinstall the extractor into the slide and recheck the extractor tension. If more tension is needed, remove the extractor from the slide and repeat the adjustment sequence. To increase extractor tension, adjust the Stop Screw outward an 1/8 of a turn and bend the extractor again.

Continue the bend and check sequence until the proper extractor tension is reached. Turning the Stop Screw an eighth of a turn will usually produce from between 3 to 5 ounces of additional extractor tension. All extractors will vary but this is a good starting point. If your extractor is too tight (excessive extractor tension), I recommend you bend out the extractor and repeat the process again.

The real advantage to using these tools is you get a measurable starting point and a constant value to work with. Having the constant value of known, extractor tension and a reliable, repeatable method to change it, will help you solve extractor and feeding problems quickly and accurately.​
 

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I read so many articles on this forum about 1911 extractors (not Just Taurus) but all 1911 manufactures that had broken or were going to, i called Taurus and ordered one so i would have a spare for my 2010 PT1911,
Customer service ask for my serial number said he would send me a new one, I ask if they were going to invoice me or have me pay now, CS said there would be no charge, Ask for my mailing address and hung the phone up.
With no ref.# or anything else to document our conversation i was a little concerned, after about a month my extractor arrived in the mail !

Now for the rest of the story, as Paul Harvey would say, this was a used pistol from an individual that i had traded for,it was a very clean pistol but i soon found out it had extractor problems, With help from members on this forum and some good extractor articles, i realized the extractor just needed tuning, i did it myself using my hands to bend it, and then polished the areas of the extractor called for in the article, it shoots everything i feed it now, im still using the extractor that came in the gun
So have faith its not that complicated, just pay attention
 

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A while back I called Taurus and ordered a spare one. It was only like $12 or something, so it was no big deal. I didn't even try to get them to send me one for free.
 
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