Interesting visit with my pastor this afternoon. - Page 5
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by NativeTexan View Post
    I'm a one shot, one kill kinda guy anyhow and like to place my shot, ... Might be praying, sure, but not spraying. I've never trained that way, so it'd be my instinct to place my shots as carefully as possible. Accuracy counts and as ol' Wyatt said, you cannot miss fast enough.
    I'm thinking if Old Scratch is directing this kid, he may have instructed the kid to buy body armor beforehand. A head shot may be the only way to neutralize him. I had thought about asking all the little old grannies in the church's knitting circle to bring their longest, sharpest needles to service. Before they packed up their knitting at their weekly gathering, I'd ask them to drill and then drill some more until each of them are able to insert that needle ninja-like into the base of the attacker's skull. One the elders spoke out and said he didn't think we should be planting ideas in the heads of women who at this point in their lives have just about had it with men.
    CaptainMorgan and Flash60601 like this.

  2. #42
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    My first thought goes back to post #1 - - if possible, it might have been prudent for the Pastor in this case to attempt to get his "buddy' the Police Chaplain involved, therefore, taking the onus of "turning the kid over to the authorities" a bit on the sly side, (discrete, if you prefer) to the police, and avoiding the impression of giving this kid up to the authorities, more like "ENLISTING THEIR HELP" in the kid's eyes. Put less of a target on the Pastor and congregation.

    Just hindsight.




    As for carrying in church, prudent husbands and fathers protect their families (I gotta add here Mothers, wives, sisters and daughters, too. Not that I'm sexist or anything, but just "equal opportunity") All the time, EVERYWHERE, - - -and there are no "safe spaces" when violators of the laws already have committed to breaking some laws, why would they car about more? And your 380 ACP in the pocket may be all that it needs. How many times have you heard of the perp who ends his attack ( by surrender or otherwise) at the first sign of resistance. Even unarmed resistance?
    You must be careful what you pretend to be, because in the end, you are what you pretend to be.
    ....................Kurt Vonnegut, in "Mother Night"

    All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible. Such people have a tendency to become drunk on violence, a condition to which they are quickly addicted. . . . . . . . . . . . .. — Frank Herbert, Chapterhouse: Dune

  3. #43
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    I think in a situation where people could be injured, notifying the authorities would be the right thing to do.
    confused likes this.

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  5. #44
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    BTW can anyone tell me why David got 5 stones ?

    Goliath had brothers

  6. #45
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    Most would be surprised how often there is a Deadly Force Incident (DFI) [abductions (& attempts), attacks, suspicious deaths, suicides & deadly force intervention / protection] at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. happen every year.

    Between 1/1/1999 and 12/31/2017 [the latest available year with full statistics] there were 1705 DFI’s. Of that number, 478 (28.04%) of the attack resulted in death of victims (homicide).

    For 2015, 2016, and 2017 the total number of nonaccidental deaths (Homicide, suicide, unsolved suspicious — and aggressors killed) vs. the total number of incidents at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. were:

    2015: 77 vs. 248
    2016: 65 vs. 246
    2017: 118 vs. 261

    The number of DFIs per week at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. for those three years are:

    2015 = 4.76/week
    2016 = 4.73/week
    2017 = 5.02/week

    Finally, the number of DFIs each week that resulted in nonaccidental deaths were:

    2015 = 1.48
    2016 = 1.25
    2017 = 2.27

    And we thought that church was a safe place!

    The above statistics were developed by Carl Chinn of the Faith Based Security Network in Colorado Springs, CO. https://fbsnamerica.com/
    Live with Integrity --- Judge with Mercy

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by RonPT24/7 View Post
    I been CC in church since i got my LTC . We all pray for Gods protection which is the best thing to do but remember God gave every human a brain that thinks and makes decisions . Make decisions wisely !! In the bible every war you read about is told how it was/is fought . Most you’ll read is where the enemy was destroyed by the sword . And that’s not just talking about God speaking words , it’s meaning a physical sword . Only David that fought with a sling shot and 5 stones and won because David was known as a man after Gods own heart and he was brave but too young and small to yield a sword . Nothing wrong with a man of God carrying protection !!

    BTW can anyone tell me why David got 5 stones ?
    I heard something one time that the extra stones were for the other relatives of Goliath. David was a civilian and in today's world would have been charged with carrying an arsenal of ammunition. Guess I have to be content with one or two magazines instead of 5.

  8. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by confused View Post
    In Texas you often hear the term "BBQ gun." I wonder if there is such a thing as a "church gun." I'm thinking a small laser equipped 380 carried in the front pants pocket might work. Oh, and a spare mag in the other pocket.

    Better yet, if it hasn't already been discussed, your church might consider establishing a security team for services and other functions during the week. CHL/LTC holders can carry their weapon as long as they are not wearing a distinctive 'security' uniform or being paid for their services. The Private Security statutes were clarified in the last couple of years to allow this.

    I carry full size firearms...ask a man by the name of Carl Chinn out of Colorado how he felt when he was confronted with a well armed man while Mr. Chinn carried a Kel Tec .32

  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by LenC View Post
    Most would be surprised how often there is a Deadly Force Incident (DFI) [abductions (& attempts), attacks, suspicious deaths, suicides & deadly force intervention / protection] at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. happen every year.

    Between 1/1/1999 and 12/31/2017 [the latest available year with full statistics] there were 1705 DFI’s. Of that number, 478 (28.04%) of the attack resulted in death of victims (homicide).

    For 2015, 2016, and 2017 the total number of nonaccidental deaths (Homicide, suicide, unsolved suspicious — and aggressors killed) vs. the total number of incidents at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. were:

    2015: 77 vs. 248
    2016: 65 vs. 246
    2017: 118 vs. 261

    The number of DFIs per week at Faith-Based Organizations in the U. S. for those three years are:

    2015 = 4.76/week
    2016 = 4.73/week
    2017 = 5.02/week

    Finally, the number of DFIs each week that resulted in nonaccidental deaths were:

    2015 = 1.48
    2016 = 1.25
    2017 = 2.27

    And we thought that church was a safe place!

    The above statistics were developed by Carl Chinn of the Faith Based Security Network in Colorado Springs, CO. https://fbsnamerica.com/
    Really not that surprising.

    Going by what a consultant shared with our church, the primary incident most church security teams have to deal with is custody conflicts. You've got the setting for plenty of abductions, and for potentially violent conflicts when custody is being contested.

    But beyond that, churches are going to be subject to whatever random violence comes, same as any other place.

    Next, church is a place where people making bad choices sometimes hear truth they don't want to hear. Truth that brings uncomfortable changes to peoples' lives, or causes feelings of shame or guilt, can inspire people to lash out at the messenger.

    Also, church is a place where people who want to leave a bad situation sometimes find the courage and faith to do so. A person who is losing control of a person whom they have abused can be a danger to whoever they see as being responsible for their loss of control.

    It begs the question -- would more people actually attending church cause an increase, or a decrease, in the incidence of violence?
    Most stereotypes come from how you treated the last person who didn't know you.

    "The greater part of mankind . . . walk blindfolded in this glorious theater." John Calvin

  10. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterM View Post
    BTW can anyone tell me why David got 5 stones ?

    Goliath had brothers
    Quote Originally Posted by gunblast View Post
    I heard something one time that the extra stones were for the other relatives of Goliath. David was a civilian and in today's world would have been charged with carrying an arsenal of ammunition. Guess I have to be content with one or two magazines instead of 5.
    Most stereotypes come from how you treated the last person who didn't know you.

    "The greater part of mankind . . . walk blindfolded in this glorious theater." John Calvin

  11. #50
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    Seems this thread has been full circle, maybe more than once. Time to shut it down. Closed.
    ​All you need for happiness is a good gun, a good horse, and a good wife.

    Texas friendly, spoken here.





 

 
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