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  1. #41
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    Anyone here on an antidepressant?
    We the People...

  2. #42
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    Good luck with that question!

    HIPAA (Health Information Portability Accountability Act) being what it is and all. My question still stands: “If someone is adjudicated as mentally unfit (for purposes of firearm purchase and ownership) HOW, exactly, is that information transmitted to NICS?” Supposedly dishonorable discharges ARE supposed to be automatically forwarded to NICS (even tho the Texas church shooter from a year or so ago proves an imperfect system); so how are mental adjudications forwarded?

    If HIPAA proves to be so watertight as to legally prevent potentially dangerous patients’ info from being forwarded to agencies designed specifically for firearm/public safety then maybe we need to pass GIPAA. Guns Information Portability and Accountability Act! Your personal firearm information is secure so that only YOU know what you have what you might use it for. That is what 2A was originally designed for - your PERSONAL right to keep and bear arms. The Founding Fathers (all < 40 years of age, BTW) wanted other Americans to take responsibility for policing themselves and their communities; remember the first American city to form a police force (LEO dept) didn’t do so until ~ late 1820s-1830s - 40 years after the foundation of our nation. It would be another 110 years before the FBI took life.
    rollin thunder likes this.
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    “Violent crime is feasible only when it’s victims are cowards. A victim who fights back makes the whole business impractical. - Col Jeff Cooper

    With over 200 million firearms in private possession, in addition to a collective ammo round count of over a trillion rounds, it should be obvious that we in the firearm community and culture are NOT the problem!

    Governments don’t create human rights; they either recognize them or suppress them

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by rollin thunder View Post
    Anyone here on an antidepressant?

    No, but I may need one before this is all over.

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  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by texastaurusguy View Post
    Daytona, I've wondered too why they can't just tie mental health records to the federal background check system - I've always guessed that medical records are more difficult to report in, or they really have no way of categorizing them in a way where a patient is rated a danger to buy a gun. If there were a good, and honest, way to do it, I wouldn't be opposed to relaxing HIIPA laws for that purpose. However....here is where politicians can ruin the entire thing. Exactly what gets reported as a person who is a danger to himself or others isn't necessarily up to the doctor, it's what politicians say it means. So, if I went to see a psychiatrist as, for example, part of a family issue or discussion, and the doctor put my name into the database as part of that discussion or session, and it fed up to NICS, who's to say that I wouldn't be prohibited from buying a firearm the next time I want to? Or, that it flagged me with my local PD and they came and took my guns away? I don't like the idea of my gun ownership being decided at the whim of a politician in Washington, no not one bit.

    Until they figure out a way to fix that, and guarantee that it won't happen, and that people who do legitimately have their guns taken away have a path to getting their guns back at some point that doesn't involve them spending thousands of dollars in legal fees, then I'd be opposed to the whole thing.
    I believe that question is key to improving background checks. It would almost take psychiatrists etc to have a firearm box on a check off form. You certainly can't flag everyone who goes to a shrink because their kid is having trouble in school. I don't see that every happening. It will remain a mystery and they will keep imposing roadblocks that make it harder for good people to get guns. I mean, that's their plan anyway isn't it?
    "I can't fix stupid but I can fix stupid's dog"

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  6. #45
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    Here we have two separate issues. 1. is keeping guns out of the hands of those that should not have or get them in the 1st place, Background Checks.. 2. Getting guns out of the hands of those that may have gone off the deep end after they already have guns. Same basic issue, two different scenarios.

    I say one issue at a time and lets get it right the fist time.

    The other frightening thing to me is in reading some blogs or news Vines is the number of people that conflate Background Checks with Gun Registration thinking they are one in the same or just interchangeable.. That is how uninformed some folks are on the issue.
    I am a Veteran, I am a Husband, Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather.
    I was labeled a Deplorable, now I'm a Nationalist rather than a Globalist! As a USA Veteran I will proudly wear that to protect our Nation!
    When they can figure out how to legislate Morality and Conscience I will consider talking more gun laws.


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  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlr110 View Post
    No, but I may need one before this is all over.
    I know what you mean. I'm just so over all this BS!
    dlr110 and pegasus like this.
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  8. #47
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    Again, who makes these decisions? Most therapists are very, very liberal. Politicians shouldn't touch this with a ten foot pole. A jury of your peers, though no charges have been brought forth?

    Let me ask this: People are extremely comfortable with having their own transportation. We really like our cars, yet drunk drivers kill volumes of people compared to shooting someone out of anger and vengeance or accidental shootings. Do you think we could ever take away our cars because of a few million drunks?
    Why? Because we'll justify it, in order to keep our own.
    If we are going to have true liberty, things like the Walmart shootings are going to happen. The numbers in comparison, are nonexistent.

    20 people were killed. How many people did drunk drivers kill that day? And for arguments sake, we should include jacks falling on people. Cars rolling over owners and every other oddity there is.

    You have guns, you have freedom, people die. Life goes on.

    Do you want to talk about the heroin epidemic and the amount of people that kills, families ruined?
    Pools
    Playgrounds
    Open manholes
    Obesity
    Smoking
    Woman's clinics

    Just a start...
    We the People...

  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by rollin thunder View Post
    Again, who makes these decisions? Most therapists are very, very liberal. Politicians shouldn't touch this with a ten foot pole. A jury of your peers, though no charges have been brought forth?

    Let me ask this: People are extremely comfortable with having their own transportation. We really like our cars, yet drunk drivers kill volumes of people compared to shooting someone out of anger and vengeance or accidental shootings. Do you think we could ever take away our cars because of a few million drunks?
    Why? Because we'll justify it, in order to keep our own.
    If we are going to have true liberty, things like the Walmart shootings are going to happen.. The numbers in comparison, are nonexistent.

    20 people were killed. How many people did drunk drivers kill that day? And for arguments sake, we should include jacks falling on people. Cars rolling over owners and every other oddity there is.

    You have guns, you have freedom, people die. Life goes on.

    Do you want to talk about the heroin epidemic and the amount of people that kills, families ruined?
    Pools
    Playgrounds
    Open manholes
    Obesity
    Smoking
    Woman's clinics

    Just a start...
    This is the crux for the entire issue played out all over the world. There are no guarantees or warrantees issued whenever you are born into this world. You could die at childbirth. You could die if any number of childhood illness. You can die as the victim of a drunk driver you you could be shot down in the next mass active shooter episode. You you could die at 95, of plain old age.

    But we ALL die sometime! Nobody gets out of life alive?
    As our ancestors settled this great nation, they either overcame adversity or perished. We all go about our days doing whatever it is we do. Hundreds die every day due to wrecks, falls, crime, etc. But the people mourn them move on. There is absolutely no way to guarantee that you will survive a day just because you woke up that day.

    But, building on something else I mentioned, a lot of the displaced, antisocial loner tweens are empowered by what they can accomplish on the NET with no oversight no positive role models and protected by the anonymity of the NET.
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    “Violent crime is feasible only when it’s victims are cowards. A victim who fights back makes the whole business impractical. - Col Jeff Cooper

    With over 200 million firearms in private possession, in addition to a collective ammo round count of over a trillion rounds, it should be obvious that we in the firearm community and culture are NOT the problem!

    Governments don’t create human rights; they either recognize them or suppress them

  10. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark7mod0 View Post
    Saw this an I guess it is the best description of why these laws are Red Flag Laws are hated and apt to fail. Here’s what will happen...

    It’s a Sunday night and your family has all gone to bed. You let the dogs back in and lock the deadbolt like you do every night. All the lights are off now except a couple of night lights scattered throughout the house leaving that dim glow throughout your home. It’s bedtime and work and school are going to come early in the morning. You crawl in bed, kiss your wife and drift off to sleep being thankful for the air conditioning that allows you to pull that heavy quilt up over your shoulder despite the fact it’s still 85 degrees outside. A few hours pass...

    0200 Monday morning and your wife taps your leg and says, “baby I heard something outside”. As you sit up in bed you hear the dog growling in the living room and you know something isn’t right. You grab that trusty ole 870 and head into the living room. Your wife grabs her 9mm and heads down the hall to the kids rooms just like you have rehearsed. “Good boy” you say as you enter the living room, trying to calm both the dog and your wife just as splinters fly across the room and the front door flys open. “Oh crap!” As you shoulder your weapon and send a load of 00 Buck across your living room and see the perpetrator fall in a heap. Before the “thank God” can even run across your brain, you see a second man coming in the door and you fire again. This time you hear the pop of your wife’s 9mm as she has joined in the fight. It has to be those damn meth heads from down in town!

    Just then you are consumed by a wall of bullets as you see multiple muzzle flashes from just outside the door and you realize something isn’t right. You turn to yell at your wife to “get down” just in time to see her take a load of buckshot to the face and her brain matter splatter the wall behind her. You feel the burning as 5.56 bullets Riddle your body. One clips your spine as you’re scrambling away and paralyzes your lower body. The last thing you see before you bleed out is a SWAT guy from your local PD holding your teenage daughter on the floor with a knee in her back as she screams and cry’s because she just watched her parents being murdered.

    Why did this happen? You’re no criminal. You’re a Conservative and an honest family man. Your wife is a school teacher and your daughters are on honor roll. Why did this happen?

    Well two days ago, you and your wife went down to welcome the new neighbors to the community. Your wife made them some of her “world famous” cookies and you invited them to church on Sunday. Later that afternoon, you got a friend request on Facebook from your new neighbor, which you gladly accepted. They seemed a little odd, but in the few minutes you talked they were pleasant enough. The next day while you and your family sat in church, your new neighbor scrolled through your Facebook profile. He saw that “Trump 2020” post and got infuriated. See, he’s a staunch liberal and he hates your kind. The next thing he sees are the hunting pictures you took last fall when your daughter bagged her first buck. Now he’s seething with fury because he is wholeheartedly against the “slaughter of innocent animals”. Next he sees your post from the last range day with your buddy and sees those scary black assault weapons on the table and that does it! He has to do something about the racist domestic terrorist living next door. He picks up the phone, calls the local Sheriffs Office and reports you as a threat under the new Red Flag law. The SO follows their SOP’s and conducts a no knock warrant because you have now been denied due process and you are considered guilty until proven innocent.

    Now you, your lovely wife and two deputies have been killed for nothing. Your daughter will have absolute hell for the rest of her life. She will never be that successful person you dreamed for her to be because of the mental illnesses caused from seeing her parents murdered. The local news paper will report that you were killed after firing on and killing two deputies and that “over a thousand rounds of ammo and 22 guns were confiscated from your residence”.
    Oh, those two deputies were just following orders. They left behind families as well and had served their community for over a decade. They didn’t know you were a stand-up guy with a great family. They weren’t allowed time to investigate things under due process. They were told you had threatened your neighbor and were out in the street waving an AR15 around.

    This is the reality of Red Flag gun laws. Innocent people will lose their lives. Red Flag laws will be used for petty and vengeful reasons without merit.
    The moral of this story? Turn all your guns in now.
    Last edited by daytonaredeye; 08-11-2019 at 08:17 AM. Reason: language and some paragraph breaks

  11. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by rollin thunder View Post
    Again, who makes these decisions? Most therapists are very, very liberal. Politicians shouldn't touch this with a ten foot pole. A jury of your peers, though no charges have been brought forth?

    Just a start...
    Yes this quickly turns into civil matter of "He said, She said", now prove it did or did not happen.
    I am a Veteran, I am a Husband, Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather.
    I was labeled a Deplorable, now I'm a Nationalist rather than a Globalist! As a USA Veteran I will proudly wear that to protect our Nation!
    When they can figure out how to legislate Morality and Conscience I will consider talking more gun laws.


    Join the fun!

 

 
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