Looking for Advice from FFL holders - Page 6
Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 4567 LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 66
Like Tree120Likes

Thread: Looking for Advice from FFL holders

  1. #51
    Senior Member
    Member #
    42232
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,836
    Liked
    2598 times
    Quote Originally Posted by MadKaw View Post
    If someone is delayed or denied the FFL is required to give the customer a form explaining the appeals process and a copy of their NTN.
    No problem, then the FFL can just blame the system for making the mistake.
    Brian


    "Resistance is never futile" - Me

  2. #52
    Senior Member
    Member #
    13828
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    26,567
    Liked
    36216 times
    I have tried to be very laid back and just listen to the discussion because I am sincerely trying to figure out something that I find difficult.

    There is one theme, however, that I feel I must comment on because some of you are flat wrong. If you think you can predict how an abused person will react or what they would say you are wrong. You are basing your idea on how you think you would react.

    I work with a local shelter which, in addition to running a physical building where people suffering abuse can be housed, also puts people into situations where they can truly hide; where nobody knows where they are. The only records are doubly encrypted and the keys is kept offsite in separate locations.(That's my contribution.) That is the level of care that has to sometimes be taken to keep an abuser and their victim apart. There have been a couple of cases locally where someone who thought they could hide without skilled help were found and tortured.

    But the reason you are wrong is that long term abuse creates a mental state very similar to borderline personality disorder. (It may be BPD but I am not competent to make that judgement.) If you have ever lived with an individual with BPD you would realize that a sane version of logic stands no chance of predicting the behavior of someone with BPD. Would a victim say something likely to set off their abuser? I have no idea, and neither do you. It depends on the victim; the abuser; the relationship; and probably the phase of the moon.

    Those of you who have never dealt with abuse from either side … consider yourself very very lucky. It is not always as easy to get yourself out of as a sane person would think.

    Enough of a rant. I do actually appreciate those of you on either side of this discussion. Any time you see only one side, you have no doubt that you are right. And I have been deeply troubled by this situation. I believe in individual rights. I believe in the [competent] individual's right to determine their own destiny. I am also deeply committed to protecting those who are unable to protect themselves. And I recognize the difficulty of determining the differences. That is why this is difficult.

    Anyway, let me take this remarkably appropriate opportunity to wish all of you a peaceful and safe Chanukah and Christmas. Please pray for those both here and abroad whose holidays will be neither peaceful nor safe.
    Keeper of The Pledge

    GCS d? s+: a+++ C++ UL++++ P+ L++ E W++ N++ o+ K- w
    O M-- V-- PS+++ PE++ Y++ PGP++ t 5++ X- R+ tv+ b++++ DI++++ D+
    G-- e+++ h---- r+++ y+++ PL++++

    ∀xx ∃xy | xx∇xy > 0

    If the Russians hacked Clinton's email then she is guilty of a felony for exposing classified information to a hostile government.

  3. #53
    Senior Member
    Member #
    35806
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Sevierville, TN
    Posts
    10,022
    Liked
    15446 times
    Quote Originally Posted by MadKaw View Post
    I have tried to be very laid back and just listen to the discussion because I am sincerely trying to figure out something that I find difficult.

    There is one theme, however, that I feel I must comment on because some of you are flat wrong. If you think you can predict how an abused person will react or what they would say you are wrong. You are basing your idea on how you think you would react.

    I work with a local shelter which, in addition to running a physical building where people suffering abuse can be housed, also puts people into situations where they can truly hide; where nobody knows where they are. The only records are doubly encrypted and the keys is kept offsite in separate locations.(That's my contribution.) That is the level of care that has to sometimes be taken to keep an abuser and their victim apart. There have been a couple of cases locally where someone who thought they could hide without skilled help were found and tortured.

    But the reason you are wrong is that long term abuse creates a mental state very similar to borderline personality disorder. (It may be BPD but I am not competent to make that judgement.) If you have ever lived with an individual with BPD you would realize that a sane version of logic stands no chance of predicting the behavior of someone with BPD. Would a victim say something likely to set off their abuser? I have no idea, and neither do you. It depends on the victim; the abuser; the relationship; and probably the phase of the moon.

    Those of you who have never dealt with abuse from either side … consider yourself very very lucky. It is not always as easy to get yourself out of as a sane person would think.

    Enough of a rant. I do actually appreciate those of you on either side of this discussion. Any time you see only one side, you have no doubt that you are right. And I have been deeply troubled by this situation. I believe in individual rights. I believe in the [competent] individual's right to determine their own destiny. I am also deeply committed to protecting those who are unable to protect themselves. And I recognize the difficulty of determining the differences. That is why this is difficult.

    Anyway, let me take this remarkably appropriate opportunity to wish all of you a peaceful and safe Chanukah and Christmas. Please pray for those both here and abroad whose holidays will be neither peaceful nor safe.
    You are doing the same thing trying to predict how the gun will be used. Bottom line is you are taking someones laughing statement as a reason to deny someone else his 2nd amendment. Im just saying id need more proof to deny him.
    I don't always open carry, but when I do I prefer DeSantis.

  4. Remove Advertisements
    TaurusArmed.net
    Advertisements
     

  5. #54
    Senior Member
    Member #
    13828
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    26,567
    Liked
    36216 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnum_Gauge View Post
    You are doing the same thing trying to predict how the gun will be used. Bottom line is you are taking someones laughing statement as a reason to deny someone else his 2nd amendment. Im just saying id need more proof to deny him.
    The Second Amendment limits the the actions of the government, not private parties. Has nothing to do with the question. As an individual I cannot tell him he cannot have a gun. But I don't have to sell it to him.
    Keeper of The Pledge

    GCS d? s+: a+++ C++ UL++++ P+ L++ E W++ N++ o+ K- w
    O M-- V-- PS+++ PE++ Y++ PGP++ t 5++ X- R+ tv+ b++++ DI++++ D+
    G-- e+++ h---- r+++ y+++ PL++++

    ∀xx ∃xy | xx∇xy > 0

    If the Russians hacked Clinton's email then she is guilty of a felony for exposing classified information to a hostile government.

  6. #55
    Senior Member
    Member #
    14614
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Texas, Near Fort Worth
    Posts
    29,311
    Liked
    35213 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnum_Gauge View Post
    Its so weird when we agree TA
    MG you and I on the same page brings this scene from Ghostbusters to mind

    Magnum_Gauge likes this.
    "Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem" (I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery) Thomas Jefferson in a letter to James Madison

    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

    "If everyone is thinking alike then someone isn't thinking!" General Patton

    "If we waited for Washington to tell us when to plant, we should soon want bread." Thomas Jefferson


  7. #56
    Senior Member
    Member #
    14614
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Texas, Near Fort Worth
    Posts
    29,311
    Liked
    35213 times
    Quote Originally Posted by MadKaw View Post
    The Second Amendment limits the the actions of the government, not private parties. Has nothing to do with the question. As an individual I cannot tell him he cannot have a gun. But I don't have to sell it to him.
    I do agree with MadKaw here.
    "Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem" (I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery) Thomas Jefferson in a letter to James Madison

    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

    "If everyone is thinking alike then someone isn't thinking!" General Patton

    "If we waited for Washington to tell us when to plant, we should soon want bread." Thomas Jefferson


  8. #57
    Senior Member
    Member #
    14614
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Texas, Near Fort Worth
    Posts
    29,311
    Liked
    35213 times
    Quote Originally Posted by MadKaw View Post
    I have tried to be very laid back and just listen to the discussion because I am sincerely trying to figure out something that I find difficult.

    There is one theme, however, that I feel I must comment on because some of you are flat wrong. If you think you can predict how an abused person will react or what they would say you are wrong. You are basing your idea on how you think you would react.

    I work with a local shelter which, in addition to running a physical building where people suffering abuse can be housed, also puts people into situations where they can truly hide; where nobody knows where they are. The only records are doubly encrypted and the keys is kept offsite in separate locations.(That's my contribution.) That is the level of care that has to sometimes be taken to keep an abuser and their victim apart. There have been a couple of cases locally where someone who thought they could hide without skilled help were found and tortured.

    But the reason you are wrong is that long term abuse creates a mental state very similar to borderline personality disorder. (It may be BPD but I am not competent to make that judgement.) If you have ever lived with an individual with BPD you would realize that a sane version of logic stands no chance of predicting the behavior of someone with BPD. Would a victim say something likely to set off their abuser? I have no idea, and neither do you. It depends on the victim; the abuser; the relationship; and probably the phase of the moon.

    Those of you who have never dealt with abuse from either side … consider yourself very very lucky. It is not always as easy to get yourself out of as a sane person would think.

    Enough of a rant. I do actually appreciate those of you on either side of this discussion. Any time you see only one side, you have no doubt that you are right. And I have been deeply troubled by this situation. I believe in individual rights. I believe in the [competent] individual's right to determine their own destiny. I am also deeply committed to protecting those who are unable to protect themselves. And I recognize the difficulty of determining the differences. That is why this is difficult.

    Anyway, let me take this remarkably appropriate opportunity to wish all of you a peaceful and safe Chanukah and Christmas. Please pray for those both here and abroad whose holidays will be neither peaceful nor safe.
    MadKaw I believe protecting those who are not able to protect themselves and who at the same time want help is both noble and Honorable. I would do the same and I wish more people would.

    I think the specific question though is does this instance fit that bill? Granted I was not there so I am basing this completely on what was posted, I don't believe it fits either criteria where inolvement would be justified.
    "Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem" (I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery) Thomas Jefferson in a letter to James Madison

    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

    "If everyone is thinking alike then someone isn't thinking!" General Patton

    "If we waited for Washington to tell us when to plant, we should soon want bread." Thomas Jefferson


  9. #58
    Senior Member
    Member #
    13828
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    26,567
    Liked
    36216 times
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasAviator View Post
    MadKaw I believe protecting those who are not able to protect themselves and who at the same time want help is both noble and Honorable. I would do the same and I wish more people would.

    I think the specific question though is does this instance fit that bill? Granted I was not there so I am basing this completely on what was posted, I don't believe it fits either criteria where inolvement would be justified.
    We disagree. Keep this in mind…both the enabling legislation and company policy require me to exercise my judgement and refuse to sell if I have any doubts about the sale.
    Keeper of The Pledge

    GCS d? s+: a+++ C++ UL++++ P+ L++ E W++ N++ o+ K- w
    O M-- V-- PS+++ PE++ Y++ PGP++ t 5++ X- R+ tv+ b++++ DI++++ D+
    G-- e+++ h---- r+++ y+++ PL++++

    ∀xx ∃xy | xx∇xy > 0

    If the Russians hacked Clinton's email then she is guilty of a felony for exposing classified information to a hostile government.

  10. #59
    Senior Member
    Member #
    35806
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Sevierville, TN
    Posts
    10,022
    Liked
    15446 times
    Quote Originally Posted by MadKaw View Post
    We disagree. Keep this in mind…both the enabling legislation and company policy require me to exercise my judgement and refuse to sell if I have any doubts about the sale.
    I meant no disrespect for anything MabKaw. I was just giving my opinion based on what you said. Not being there I can't make a true judgement. But I respect your opinion very much and know that you will judge the situation as best you see it. I'm sure whatever you do in these situations will be the right decisions. Just follow your instincts.

    On a side note however I've known many people involved in domestic abuse and never once have they joked or laughed about it. Doesn't mean it couldn't happen though.
    I don't always open carry, but when I do I prefer DeSantis.

  11. #60
    Senior Member
    Member #
    4800
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Republic of West Florida
    Posts
    29,374
    Liked
    30013 times
    ...maybe you should get to know her first...
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    NULLI SECUNDUS

 

 
Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 4567 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. CCW Holders and Wal-Mart
    By Ironmagz in forum Concealed & Open Carry
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 04-28-2013, 03:13 AM
  2. IWB Mag holders
    By diverdown87 in forum Concealed & Open Carry
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-13-2011, 01:05 AM
  3. Mag Holders for 24/7 C DS 9mm and 45?
    By BigJon in forum 24/7 Series
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 02-13-2011, 11:48 PM
  4. FFL Holders
    By Eagle Guns in forum Lounge
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-16-2007, 10:29 AM