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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickthus View Post
    We have been keeping the weak and frail alive and protected for years with modern medicine. This virus is no big threat to the healthy population. This was and is the wrong approach as their was boo containing it. This was sold to us as away to keep hospitals from over loading. This never happened. It only over load the very old and weak in nursing homes. Protect the weak and old and move on already. Its a done deal. Its not going to get any better than it is now. If I were not 59 with a clotting issue taking care of my terminal 83yr Oldman I would be using a mask and going about my day. It is what it is. My Kids and other family are helping keep us locked down here as they are going out and about their everyday life. The sun comes up and it will, With or without you.
    "Weak and frail."

    Well, I'm in my late 60s, and I can outrun a whole lot of men half my age. But I can't outrun a virus.


    Thirty percent of Americans under 65 still have comorbidities that make them susceptible to covid-19 death as well as lingering or permanent damage to lungs, kidneys, and other organs and to strokes and other issues. But those are working age people, so they can't be isolated.


    Moreover, 60% of Americans age 60 and 40% Americans age 65 are still part of the working population--they can't be isolated.


    And most of those who are no longer working still live with younger relatives (not in elderly communities), so they can't be isolated either.


    Bottom line: There's no reality in talking about isolating the "weak and frail." It's impracticable in America.
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  2. #22
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    I'm going to ramble here.


    While I don't fully agree with the lockdown I do understand the purpose. Governors didn't want their state to turn into another New York where the hospitals were overrun and doctors were having to decide who got ventilators and basically, who died. At 60 had I been brought into the hospital at the same moment as someone 24 years old with a wife and three kids, I can guess who would have gotten the last ventilator.

    Where I'm at it's business as usual at the hospitals. Nothing close to overrun. NC has one of the lowest death rates in the country, luckily.

    Now, after weeks of lockdown hospitals have a better idea what they need, and what they can handle. Businesses have a plan to reopen with some safeguards in place. Here, restaurants can open this weekend at fifty percent capacity. More stores were opened as of last weekend. So, it's getting back to the new normal.

    I do think some governors went on a power trip. The madam Queen in Michigan especially. The guy in Kalifornia the same. I do think some states went too far with this.
    Last edited by dwhite; 05-21-2020 at 06:26 AM.
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  3. #23
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    So you're in favor of trading liberty for security? That's fine for YOUR choice. You, and the government, have no right to impose restrictions on me because you might get sick. Suppose there was a "shooting pandemic?" Would you be in favor of banning guns?

    Don't believe the hype. This is nowhere near as bad as the media portrays it. Even Dr. Birx says she doesn't trust data from the CDC, and the it has likely been inflated by 25 percent. Much of the death stats are fraudulent-the fed pays for corona related medical expenses, and 20 percent more for Medicare/Medicaid patients suffering corona. NYC back dated death certificated for 3700 deaths, alleging the diagnosis of any pulmonary related death was "likely" corona. the government is sending us cash and we are applauding it, some of us even on this forum. This is the stealth implementation of socialism.

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  5. #24
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    I agree whole heartedly with a lot that is said here. I work as a contractor on Navy ships and have been home isolated for 64 day to date. I spent almost a year in the same situation in 2017 due to cancer hence why I am back “in the box”. Basically, my immune system is like a two-year-old and I’m, well, old.
    Lucky the test I do for the Navy I can also write from home and my employer is awesome.
    Long story short, what we are doing now I have been for the most part doing for two years. Now just a bit more sterile.
    Yes, we need to protect and we need to work. I see the politics and science mix as well as politics and religion as well as gas and water…. turns into a quagmire. This is what we have going on:
    We are all soldiers in this war but we can’t get everyone shooting in the same direction and we wind up with some getting infected/kill by friendly fire. It is looking like some people have put themselves into the same positions our generals were in during WWI and WWII, deciding on a strategy with an equation have a “marginal life expendability”.
    I’m not a politician or a priest. I am al about the science of the matter. Frankly, I am still breathing air because if it. It is kind of simple, Covid is spread from host to host by entering the mouth, nose, eyes. If we can get everyone……EVERYONE to be responsible to prevent the spread we can all go back to work and if Covid does not have host to host propagation, we can beat it. Of course, we still need a vaccine to keep it at bay just as we do the flu. If everyone would wear masks (sorry if you are giving me the Freedom – Constitutional BS we will just have to agree to disagree) both workers and customers, keep the distancing, it does work.
    I miss working with the Navy crew, my trips to the range, seeing my mom. I also love living. If we use the science not our emotions or fears this will be behind us.

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  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredward View Post
    So you're in favor of trading liberty for security? That's fine for YOUR choice. You, and the government, have no right to impose restrictions on me because you might get sick. Suppose there was a "shooting pandemic?" Would you be in favor of banning guns?

    Don't believe the hype. This is nowhere near as bad as the media portrays it. Even Dr. Birx says she doesn't trust data from the CDC, and the it has likely been inflated by 25 percent. Much of the death stats are fraudulent-the fed pays for corona related medical expenses, and 20 percent more for Medicare/Medicaid patients suffering corona. NYC back dated death certificated for 3700 deaths, alleging the diagnosis of any pulmonary related death was "likely" corona. the government is sending us cash and we are applauding it, some of us even on this forum. This is the stealth implementation of socialism.
    We are finding this to be more true than some would like. Some states came out up front and said they would treat every death as a Covid-19 death. Other states are now reviewing their autopsy reports and finding they erroneously labeled those who died OF covid-19 and those who died WITH covid-19. They revised the stats and cv-19 deaths dropped 13-15%.
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  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zen Ape View Post
    Case in point...
    Well, I don't trust government, let alone a communist dictator. There seems to be a lot of dictators in state gooberment lately. Some wish to be lorded over by the "experts". Some believe in individual freedom, the kind our founding fathers believed in. If you wish to give up your control to communists, go ahead, but move to Cuba. Leave the rest of us to the constitution.


    I'm sorry, but I won't give up my basic principles over a strand of RNA. But, some folks don't get an education in civics, don't learn from history. That is increasingly the case in modern schools run by communists. But, then, if you're never taught history, you won't recognize it when it repeats itself. That's the past, don't relate to the present . SO, if you don't get educated in the ways of gooberment, learn to appreciate freedom rather than government, it's a lot easier just to submit to the king. Why bother with a vote, big waste of money and time. Bring back the monarchy. Then, everyone will be happy and the state police will insure descenters are weeded out. God save the king, oh wait, there is no God. Jesus is way ancient history.
    Last edited by NativeTexan; 05-21-2020 at 08:28 AM.
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  8. #27
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    Folks .... WHO, politically, gains from locking down the economy forever? The economy was booming big time do to DJT's deregulation. It was epic, unprecedented in history. The left found it less than desirable to refute such facts, KNEW they had no chance running against that sort of success They would have lost no matter who they ran against it. This glorified flu epidemic came along and the gooberment scared all the sheeple. Shutting down the economy was all too easy. It was so predictable, but they slipped it right by DJT which somehow doesn't surprise me either. He was convinced the flu would kill everybody, too. Heck, I'd rather be dead than live in tyrany.

    Might as well dissolve this union at this point. There'll be no jobs for you working stiffs to go back to. The only reason to keep the union at this point is defense and if we have no jobs, no economy, how long can THAT last? The carriers will have to be outfitted with biplanes. We won't be able to fund the latest fighter aircraft.
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  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by NativeTexan View Post
    Folks .... WHO, politically, gains from locking down the economy forever? The economy was booming big time do to DJT's deregulation. It was epic, unprecedented in history. The left found it less than desirable to refute such facts, KNEW they had no chance running against that sort of success They would have lost no matter who they ran against it. This glorified flu epidemic came along and the gooberment scared all the sheeple. Shutting down the economy was all too easy. It was so predictable, but they slipped it right by DJT which somehow doesn't surprise me either. He was convinced the flu would kill everybody, too. Heck, I'd rather be dead than live in tyrany.

    Might as well dissolve this union at this point. There'll be no jobs for you working stiffs to go back to. The only reason to keep the union at this point is defense and if we have no jobs, no economy, how long can THAT last? The carriers will have to be outfitted with biplanes. We won't be able to fund the latest fighter aircraft.
    No one gains from locking down the economy forever. Absolutely no one. The damage has been done and for the next few months we are going to start stutter stop in just about every industry as we try to figure out how best to go about it safely. Look at GM this week for example. They opened two car factories and had to close them two days later as employees were getting sick and testing positive. There's no way to make the economy the monster that it was again anytime this year, so if you think this is a democrat ploy to make the president look bad and have his crown jewel missing from his head, that horse is out of the barn already. In fact we are only now starting to see the damages, they will come much more into focus as many people find they don't have jobs to go back to, and millions of bills go unpaid.

    Also, let's not act like this was something that only America did. As the virus spread outward and traveled across the globe, country after country closed its shops, its borders, its economy. Very few didn't take the nuclear option when defending against this virus because it very much appeared to be the big one we all had been hearing about for decades. The jury is still very much out on whether that's the case or not, because we still don't know enough about this virus and its long term affects and we're still not even half a year into this. We had weeks to prepare as all the canaries further down the tunnel dropped dead one by one. Weeks. What did we do with that time? Pretended it was nothing to worry about. Pretended it was the flu. It would go away like a miracle. Just wait until the warmer months in April. A vaccine is on the way soon. Seemingly overnight we went from down playing it to shutting everything down and announcing that if we could keep the American death toll between 100k-200k, it will have been because of a great job done by all and our timely response.

    You want to hurt Trump right now, all you need to do is point at the last several months of him hot footing from one hope to the next while being the most lame duck inconsistent mess of a president when it comes to responding to a world wide emergency in living memory. Display example after example, lie after lie, with the proof for all to see (that are willing to see anyway). Just roll the tape, hell you don't even need to exaggerate. I mean here's a guy that won't put on a mask but he will take a drug the CDC strongly advised against just recently. This entire administration has been the very definition of Hot Mess (and that's putting it mildly) since this pandemic first started. What you don't need to do is try and keep the economy suffering, as that's going to be on life support for quite some time.
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  10. #29
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    This country EXISTS because we are unlike others. As far as Democrats not benefitting, look again. I lived thru the Hong Kong flu epidemic, which was far worse than this. That was the year we socially distanced at Woodstock.

  11. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredward View Post
    So you're in favor of trading liberty for security? That's fine for YOUR choice. You, and the government, have no right to impose restrictions on me because you might get sick. Suppose there was a "shooting pandemic?" Would you be in favor of banning guns?
    You support drunk driving laws? Why? You think they're a good idea? If you're stopped for drunk driving alone you've neither injured anyone nor relieved them of property. You had some drinks and went for a drive and didn't hurt anyone. DWI laws and drug laws are the only laws I know of where you can be deprived of your liberty for causing no harm to anyone at all.

    Well, lockdown is like drunk driving laws. Not there to protect YOU, the drunk driver. The laws are there to protect who you, the drunk driver could POTENTIALLY maim or kill.

    You as an individual could do the same with drunk driving. If you feel safe enough to be out driving, fine. You accept the risk that there are more drunk drivers out there because there are no laws prohibiting it, fine. Ready to repeal those laws?
    Last edited by dwhite; 05-21-2020 at 01:50 PM.
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