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Thread: Freedom vs. Jack Ross - Reloaded Ammo Review

  1. #1
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    Freedom vs. Jack Ross - Reloaded Ammo Review

    I wrote this for another forum and thought that some of you might find the information useful:

    In this thread, I will give brief review of each of these two popular discount reloaders.

    Ordering and delivery:

    I first placed an order with Jack Ross on February 6th after seeing their deal posted on Slickguns. Order 1000 rounds of 9mm reloads for $159 + 12.50 shipping. Previously, I had always purchased cases of factory ammo at around $200, but these deals were getting harder to find, so I thought I'd take a chance.

    After placing the order, I didn't hear anything for quite a while. On March 7th, I shot them an email asking if it would take much longer. On March 8th, I received a response stating that they were still processing January orders and asked if I wished to cancel. They also said that if I wished to wait, that I would not be disappointed in their product. They also explained how short handed they were. I liked the personal touch and decided to wait.

    On April 5th, I received an email stating that my order had been "completed" and I received a FedEx tracking number shortly thereafter. I received the package on April 11th.

    A slightly different story with Freedom. I placed an order for 1000 "Blaster" training rounds on March 2nd and was changed $163.21. I received an email from them with a tracking number on March 5th. I then received a call from them on March 6th stating that their ordering system had been off and they undercharged me so asked for my authority to charge an additional $14.43. I thought this was a little odd, especially considering that I had already received a tracking number, but it was still a good deal so I agreed. I received the package on March 12th.

    Inspection:
    The Freedom Blaster Training Rounds came first. They came in bulk packaging in a big box with 250 rounds in each. I haven't counted every box, but one of the boxes had a few additional rounds. I think in the two boxes, I got about 10 additional rounds, +/- a couple.

    They looked "OK". Some looked great but most had slight blemishes. It looked as though they brass casings didn't spend much time in the tumbler. The bullets looked good for the most part, but some (I would guesstimate about 15-20%) had some visible marks/nicks. Some of these blemishes could have resulted from them being tumbled around in the bulk boxes.

    Jack Ross rounds came in individual boxes of 50 rounds in plastic holders, just like factory ammo. For most of the ammo (I inspected 4 boxes), it looked very close to factory ammo and you would have a hard time telling it apart from such from more than a few inches away. Since they are individually packed, there is no chance of getting "extra" rounds.

    Shooting:
    I shot about 200 rounds of the Freedom and 150 rounds of Jack Ross so far.

    My first time out with Freedom, I experience my first ever malfunctions with my pistol (9mm CZ P-01). I had 2 failure to feed after about 100 rounds. These rounds seemed much dirtier than anything else I had shot through the pistol previously (S&B, WWB, Remington) and completely covered the feed ramp in carbon after 100 rounds. That, couple with the slight imperfections in the bullet is what I think caused the rounds to "stick" and not feed smoothly.

    Other than that, the rounds shot well and accuracy and felt recoil was on par with other rounds I've shot.

    After shooting, cleaning the pistol confirmed my initial thought that this ammo was "dirtier". I really had to scrub some of the black powder/carbon off. I had to let my barrel sit in Hoppes for a while so it could break down the build up on my feed ramp and scrub and actually scrape it off with my finger nails.

    I didn't experience any problems with the Jack Ross ammo and I would say that it shot pretty much on par with my favorite 9mm round, S&B. No malfunctions and not very dirty.

    Cleaning the pistol afterwards was much easier and every came off easily. Not much of a build up on the feed ramp or other places. This was 50 rounds less, however.

    Conclusion:
    If I can wait or if Jack Ross can speed up their orders, I will go with them in the future. I think it is a much better value (costs less for better ammo). I don't think that Freedom ammo is a bad deal, but they are definitely in a different class. Freedom does offer non "Blaster Training" ammo, which I think are better reloads for $189+shipping per case of 1000, which I think would be more comparable to the Jack Ross reloads, but that would be roughly 22-23% more expensive and comparable price of factory ammo.

    I hope this helps.

  2. #2
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    Oops. Meant to put this in the ammo section. Can a mod please move it there for me?

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    I think that's a pretty fair review of freedom blaster. Although now they're prices with shipping are around 19 cents a round, sorry, but I can get ammo at wal-mart for that price.

    I believe I'll be placing an order to Jack Ross in the near future, so it should get here around the 4th of July! but it's much cheaper ~$40 a case.

    Being dirty doesn't bother me, but I understand that it might be worrisome for some.
    OEF Veteran and Cornfed Iowa Boy
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    My experiences were just the opposite.

    I ALWAYS received my FREEDOM orders in a matter of days, and the quality, including the "B" grade Blaster ammo has been consistently excellent. My first order for a case .45 was received exactly 7 days after ordering, delivered to the Gulf coast of Texas. My order for a case of .40 Blaster was received in Texas on the 9th day, the slowest of any of my Freedom orders, but still quite reasonable (there was an intervening holiday that week). Very fast shipping, great price, and excellent quality. They are an absolute pleasure to deal with. Just an FYI, Freedom is about to open up a Houston based retail store! I can pick up without shipping charges (but pay sales tax, which is less than shipping).

    JackRoss is another story. I STILL have not received an order for .45 placed on February 14; they charged my credit card right away. They only responded to ONE email inquiry, in early March, that said much the same as yours said - must have been a canned response. They told me that they were just caught up to January 19 orders. Their website says that my Feb 14 order is "IN PROCESS". They have NOT responded to ANY of my subsequent emails, website response input, or inquiries on their Facebook page (which they say they monitor daily). Look at the Jack Ross Facebook page and it is full of complaints similar to mine. I have receive NO responses on my second order at all!

    I decided to take a chance, and in early March order a second case of .40 from Jack Ross; I captured the website at the time of purchase, and it definitely says that delivery would be in mid-April. It is now late April, and my order is also still listed on their website as "IN PROCESS".

    While some say that the JackRoss ammo is excellent quality, I can not respond to that as I have NOT received ANY of my orders from them. Their customer service is terrible. They charge your credit card at the time the order is placed, NOT when shipped, which makes me believe that they are in financial trouble, and need the capital to survive. While their prices, including delivery were excellent, an excellent price on something that is not delivered is a horrible deal!

    I have not (yet) cancelled my 2 orders with JackRoss, because I locked in a lower price than available today, but I am sorely tempted to do so. I still want the ammo that I ordered AND PAID for!

    In the future, FREEDOM will be my primary choice for bulk orders. I absolutely CANNOT recommend JackRoss to anyone due to their horrendous customer service, and extremely long delivery times.

    I am very tempted to file a complaint with the FTC, as JackRoss may be in violation of the "30 day rule":
    Shopping by Phone or Mail

    Look at:
    Laws Governing Shipping Advertising - FindLaw

    The 30-Day Rule for Shipping Goods

    The 30 Day Rule requires that when a business advertises shipping its goods within a certain time frame, the business must have a reasonable basis for stating so. If you don't make a statement regarding shipping time, you must ship within 30 days--thus, the 30-Day Rule. The 30-day window begins when the business receives a completed order and payment.
    If the business is unable to ship within the promised time or within 30 days, the merchant must promptly tell the customer by mail, telephone or email, and give a new shipping estimate and give the customer a chance to cancel their order and receive a full refund. This offer to cancel or accept the new shipping date must give the customer sufficient time to make a decision. In other words, you can't call to inform a customer you can't make a shipping time and then demand an immediate answer.
    If you don't wish to ask the customer whether you can delay the order, you can cancel the order yourself and give a full refund within the time period shipping was promised. All refunds that are forced by shipping delays must be full refunds, and not credit for future purchases.
    Who Is Covered by the 30-Day Rule?

    The 30-Day Rule applies to goods the customer orders by:

    • Mail
    • Telephone
    • Fax
    • Internet

    Shipping Advertising and the 30-Day Rule

    The 30-Day Rule focuses solely on the method of ordering. It doesn't matter how the product is advertised or who initiates the sale. If a customer orders by any of the above methods, the shipment is covered by the Rule. The only exception would be a situation where a customer orders a product and the business sends the product along with an invoice that's payable on receipt. In this situation, the 30-Day rule does not apply, however, if you're still unreasonably slow in delivering such goods you may be in violation of FTC rules against deceptive advertising.

    -------

    Since I am very aware that there are some satisfied JackRoss customers who depend on them as an ammo source, I do not want to potentially put them out of business, BUT the penalties for violating the rule are harsh:


    Enforcement

    The FTC has wide ranging powers to enforce the 30-Day Rule. Businesses can be sued by the FTC for injunctive relief, damages of up to $16,000 per violation, and redress for the consumer. Additionally, state and local agencies can sue you for violating consumer protection laws.



    I really hope that JackRoss cleans up their act! We need good reliable sources of ammo!
    _________________________________






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    I've used Freedom twice, and they're fine. I'm just a little ticked by how quickly their prices change: according to Gun-deals.com, $159 at the start of the year, then $155 and I think a 10 % discount for a while. The price then increased to $165 in March. In April, it increased to $179 (+ $23 or so in shipping). I accept that prices are not static, but do they really need to be recalibrated once a month?

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    Quote Originally Posted by andreew View Post
    I've used Freedom twice, and they're fine. I'm just a little ticked by how quickly their prices change: according to Gun-deals.com, $159 at the start of the year, then $155 and I think a 10 % discount for a while. The price then increased to $165 in March. In April, it increased to $179 (+ $23 or so in shipping). I accept that prices are not static, but do they really need to be recalibrated once a month?
    Agreed, at $165 they were way cheaper then local, so they won. Now at $179, there's no difference than local, shipping and tax cancel out. I guess I'll just wait until they run some more specials. I cannot believe that their costs increased that much over 3 months time, I have a feeling it was an introductory price to get their name out there, it worked, but people won't stick around if you're the same price as everyone else.
    andreew likes this.
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    That's the reason why if Jack Ross gets their act together (and none of that pay NOW, but indefinite delivery nonsense), I'll buy from them next.

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    In regards to my post #4, I finally heard from JackRoss today. They responded to my website inquiry.

    In a good news - bad news scenario; the good news is that they expect to ship my case of .40 sometime next week.

    The bad news is that their .45 machine is broken; they no longer even list the .45 reloads on their website. They said nothing about when, if ever, the .45 reloads might be available, and offered me a refund on the .45, or a credit on another order (they now only have new .45 on the website at prices much higher than what I paid).

    I left a response that I still wanted the .45 that I paid for, and asked that if it was not going to be available in a reasonable time, could they substitute "something" reasonable for it?

    I will keep you posted.
    _________________________________






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    I was just on the Jack Ross site and said shippping is 6 weeks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasDeputy View Post
    In regards to my post #4, I finally heard from JackRoss today. They responded to my website inquiry.

    In a good news - bad news scenario; the good news is that they expect to ship my case of .40 sometime next week.

    The bad news is that their .45 machine is broken; they no longer even list the .45 reloads on their website. They said nothing about when, if ever, the .45 reloads might be available, and offered me a refund on the .45, or a credit on another order (they now only have new .45 on the website at prices much higher than what I paid).

    I left a response that I still wanted the .45 that I paid for, and asked that if it was not going to be available in a reasonable time, could they substitute "something" reasonable for it?

    I will keep you posted.
    I'd tell 'em the machine going down isn't your fault. You ordered .45 they agreed to ship you .45 by taking your money. Tell them you don't care how much it costs them, you already paid for ammo, that's their problem. Tell them you'll take the cheapest .45 alternative they have. The same amount of what you ordered for no extra charge.

    That's horrible business on their part. Makes me reconsider using them.
    OEF Veteran and Cornfed Iowa Boy
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