No off duty CC on Base. Example; Fort Hood

[ArmyCop]

After watching news about what happened at Fort Hood a friend of mine called asking “How in the WORLD can someone get away with shooting SO MANY people on a military installation?”.

My friend (no military background) is like a lot of folks in thinking on an Army Post or other Military Installation – EVERYBODY HAS A GUN.

Reality is far from that.

Pull out a map of either Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi or Florida – randomly pick any rural neighborhood and they will be better armed than any military installation.

On any military installation (In the US) – the only armed people are the MP’s and they are only carrying a 9mm Beretta. Some soldiers may be armed at the firing range but that’s about it.

If you see a convoy of hummers on the road in the US – National Guard or other – you might think “Someone would be crazy to attack THEM” but even if they are going to the firing range – NO ONE’S ARMED!  You drive to the range – They issue the firearms – you shoot \ qualify – TURN THEM BACK IN and drive back unarmed again.

That’s just the way it is.  No off duty CC on base.  Even the MP’s go to work unarmed – check out their weapon – do their shift – turn the weapon back in and go home…

[tarpon4me]

Each branch is different, each base is different, but that's pretty much it. A lot of bases have contracted their law enforcement duties to civilian contractors since i've got out in 2005 too, which I have mixed feelings about.

Not all bases have SRT (special response teams) either.  For those that don't know, that's the militarys version of SWAT. That means they are limited to waiting on a response from local Law Enforcement agencies. Either way, it takes time to get a team together, and the damage is going to get done.

The question does come to mind though. What if there had been a soldier carrying a weapon concealed. If they survived the first round of blasts, they very well could have taken the guy out and saved numerous lives.

How did this yahoo make it to 0-4 anyhow? From what I read, he was a problem soldier. I always talked the army up for not just passing out rank like the AF does, but this one must have slipped through the cracks.

[wyohman]

I always talked the army up for not just passing out rank like the AF does, but this one must have slipped through the cracks.

You're kidding right? The Air Force has the slowest, most deliberate promotion system of any service. This is primarily due to one reason: retention. This applies mostly to the enlisted grades as the officer promotion process is different. Pretty much all services promote their officers based on a combination of DoD and service specific guidance. I suspect 93%+ make Major regardless of service.

Cheers.

[Yellowfin]

I really hope those responsible for the no carry policy are punished and the policy reversed.  The military usually punishes boneheaded mistakes that cost lives and this is definitely one of them.

[wyohman]

I really hope those responsible for the no carry policy are punished and the policy reversed.  The military usually punishes boneheaded mistakes that cost lives and this is definitely one of them.

I think you're pissing in the wind. I predict this incident will not change any policy about CC on Federal land. This is not the first shooting of this type (although it's magnitude is unprecedented) and there were no changes in the past.

Cheers.

[orrwdd]

+1  When I was rising through the ranks, Army and Navy personnel were making it to E-6 in 5 years.  I was an E-5 for 7 years due to the high retention and many cross trainees in my field Air Traffic Control (272X0).  Everyone wanted to be an air traffic controller.

And yes you are right.  If an office did not make Major he was out of the service or riffed to enlisted.

Bill

[Oldster]

+1  When I was rising through the ranks, Army and Navy personnel were making it to E-6 in 5 years.  I was an E-5 for 7 years due to the high retention and many cross trainees in my field Air Traffic Control (272X0).  Everyone wanted to be an air traffic controller.

And yes you are right.  If an office did not make Major he was out of the service or riffed to enlisted.

Bill

I made it to E5 in five years, would have made E6 by my sixth year, but I didn't play well with others during R&R.

[Oldster]

I think you're pissing in the wind. I predict this incident will not change any policy about CC on Federal land. This is not the first shooting of this type (although it's magnitude is unprecedented) and there were no changes in the past.

Cheers.

In the early '90s Dick Marcinko was tasked to form RED CELL, a team who's mission statement and sole purpous was to stage "terrorist" attacks on naval bases to show them how lacking their security was. He and his team did too good of a job it seems and embarrassed an awful lot of admirals. The bases never changed their security policies after the exercises, and went as far as to trump up charges on Dick. I have to agree with Wyohman here, they will never change policies.

[Laker]

I'm going to visit my son next week. It'll be interesting to see what the situation is at his base. I'd like to see him armed while on duty. He's Air Force, and an air traffic controller orrwdd.

[texastaurusguy]

Before this incident, if somebody would have asked me if military guys carried sidearms while on base, I would have said "well, yeah !!".  Not so much, I guess.  It's just like walking the streets of a city, I'm finding out, it just makes sense for everybody to be carrying, instead of depending on a handful of MP's to protect hundreds of people.

[Lostfantum]

It was business as usual at the U S Naval Academy in Annapolis Maryland today.

[woodpile]

He was probably a major (O4) because he was in the medical field. Likely entered as a captain and got a default promotion for time in service. There are different standards for certain specialty officers like psychiatrists and dentists - they rarely command anything - but they might be in charge of a clinic or a medical detachment.