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Taurus "Model-Madness" or "Engineers Gone Wild"

4K views 35 replies 19 participants last post by  olfarhors 
#1 ·
Have you tried to keep up with all the "NEW" models Taurus has come with for 2010 & 2011.

Holly-Molly...I'm satified with their rendition of the 1911 and dearly love my PT111 & PT145 Millennium Pros...but...

Just when I thought I had a handle on the on going 24/7 genesis, the 800's, ad nausem they come up with the "G2" & "DT" series. :???:

No wonder their Customer Service reputation is in the toilet. They're probably going nuts just stocking parts for the latest and greatest toaster oven.

Has anyone else besides me gotten lost in space with Taurus? :)
 
#2 ·
I've been confused! They've got more acronyms than you can shake a stick at!

The website is no help either.
 
#4 ·
As long as they keep making the 92 I'll be happy. LOL!

I'll need to get a degree in rocket science to figure out some of the other models. :D
 
#5 ·
MOONDAWG said:
No wonder their Customer Service reputation is in the toilet.
From some of the CS threads I've been reading lately, it doesn't sound quite that bad.

Also, here's something to consider about new models and new lines: innovation and new technology!
We can all benefit from that!

Taurus is in business to make money, the same as any other industry; and from the excitement that is generated on our forum (myself included) by a new concept in firearms, the trend towards new "this" and new "that" will not diminish in the future.

Plus...look at any other major firearms manufacturer (Smith and Wesson, Ruger, Kahr, Sig Sauer) and you'll have to admit that "new and improved" is not just a Taurus thing.
 
#6 ·
"Engineers (designers) gone wild" is the telling phrase here.

Too often in today's world we see products they might best describe as "We do it because we can - not because it fills a need or has a purpose."

However, there may be a way out of this model confusion: Instead of numbers to designate a model series, adopt a name. Simple example: mention your PT845 to a friend and he'll say "What's that?" - but tell him you just bought a Judge and he KNOWS.

Now, Beretta has a lock on the feline family so Taurus can't use that. And I'd say stay away from the dog family - negative connotations as in "I hear that Doberman pistol is a real dog."

Could use bears, I suppose, but sooner or later you'll have a model called the Cinnamon and who wants a gun that reminds them it's time for a snack?

Birds of prey might be good: Eagle, Hawk, Condor, Merlin, Falcon... Maybe call those little .22 popguns "Hummingbird".

Or stick with the "Judge" and name categories after positions in law enforcement. Could even manufacture a Saturday Night Special and call it "The Perp".

Or jump on the OSS bandwagon and name model lines after the fighting forces that made our country both great and free: Ranger, Commando, Minuteman, Spec Ops, Recon, Spec Forces...
 
#7 ·
I really do wish they would start to move in a direction that drops all the different models.
Find the ones that work and work right the 1911,92, the Pro series and the Judge and the Raging Bull series and build them great.

Building to much of the same thing is what killed GM. Find what works and run with it, with great quality.
 
#9 ·
yea, thats my feelings too!
some of the duplication just don't seem to make a lot of sense to me,of course they are selling world wide and so we need to keep that in our minds!
but simplification would seem to make the machinery of stocking parts much easier and repairs as well.
I wonder actually just how many models and variations within those models that Taurus actually makes?
 
#11 ·
AirWrench™ said:
Still need a PT1911 Commander and a short action model.
just sayin..
Definitely so!
keep the PT1911 (and variations)and maybe ditch one of the other D/A semi auto series.
 
#12 ·
Selling worldwide, much more so than S&W, Colt, or Ruger, has it's own set of problems. Caliber restrictions, barrel-length restrictions, and local preferences all combine to form a truly weird line-up. The fact that Taurus obviously feels it beneficial to sell ALL of it's line-up in every country means that the inventory is going to be extensive. Unlike the others, who sell batches of special order guns for export, and never catalog them, you can see pretty much all of Taurus line-up.

Now, streamlining that availability could easily be done. They could decide on specific products for each sales area, and their local web-site could show only those choices. However, then they need to manage those various sites. Also, no matter which guns they list, somebody will be crying that they "really, really wanted to buy the model XXX, and were going to get one next week."

Winchester couldn't sell enough Model 94 and Model 70 rifles for years. Everyone wanted something else when it came time to put their money down. Yet, when they announced that these models were to be discontinued, it sounded like everybody was buying them, or going to buy them. There's a disconnect here somewhere.

Be happy that Taurus hasn't slimmed down our choices. From what I can see here, many of the "complaints" stem more from a sense of entitlement rather than a defective gun. ;)
 
#13 ·
JR, you've got some good points.

If one takes a look at the Brazil site, Taurus Aramas, then they might see the scope of the whole thing. That includes looking at all the models and makes of firearms and air guns. Seriously. :)

http://www.taurusarmas.com.br/

If you have a computer translator ability for Portuguese getting around the site is much easier.
 
#14 ·
45 Forever™ said:
I really do wish they would start to move in a direction that drops all the different models.
Find the ones that work and work right and build them great.

Building to much of the same thing is what killed GM. Find what works and run with it, with great quality.
Agreed! Look at Springfield, they make (market from Croatia) an XD and a 1911, perfected both, and not that easy to find what ya want.

CZ/USA: Took one perfect pistol, a Hi Power knock-off, made it "right", and then spawned off similar models.

Glock: 1 perefected pistol, many different models.

When I first started looking at Taurus for purchase, all the different types, model numbers, and nomincatures just made my head numb!
 
#15 ·
I think the thing that allows Taurus to have so many models is their manufacturing capabilities. They don't have to go outside for parts, and being able to do it all in house no doubt shortens their lead times. Doesn't necessarily make it a good idea, though. Personally I think they should take some of that engineering talent and do some perfecting as Beowulf suggests. They're biggest problem isn't selection - it's perceived reliability in the marketplace - and I think most of that is due to the magazines. And as far as I know they still don't offer adjustable sights on the milpros and 24/7's - how much engineering does that take? If they'd build some bulletproof magazines, I think that would go a loooong way to improving their reputation.

From what I can see here, many of the "complaints" stem more from a sense of entitlement rather than a defective gun.
The lifetime warranty is kind of a double-edged sword. While the above quote may be quite correct, I think it also fosters a 'screw it - we can always fix it later' mentality at Taurus. The best warranty is the one you never have to use, but the one from Taurus sometimes seems to be an integral part of their pistols. With so many models I wonder how much actual product testing they do in house, and how much of it they leave to the consumer to do for them. For my money they need less selection and more perfection.
 
#16 ·
Good points guys, however; the dogs cause all the disrespect for the good ones.

I say, get rid of the dogs and free up some money and space to stock and sell replacement parts. To me, you should be able to order any part for your gun and get it in very short order. Instead, Taurus is spread so thin, it seems parts are out of stock way too often.

I feel no entitlement whatsover with regards to having 500 models to choose from. I just think they should build the good ones, make them great and back them with outstanding service and parts.

I own a PT-92! :eek:
 
#17 ·
I see them working toward a goal of growing their business. They already had gotten a bad reputation back when, so nothing to hurt going forward. And with that being said, they might as well use the public as their QC and testing grounds as they throw as many models up against the wall to see what sticks.

Once they find the models that stick, during their incremental upgrades thanks to their customer feedback/R&D, they will be set with some nice multi-generation pistols, that all the bugs are worked out on and ready for taking market share.

And in the meantime we get good guns at low prices, with free fixes. I think it will work.
 
#18 ·
I have no problem with innovations or improvements "where needed" but the "small-medium-large-frame" and "Slim Line" areas in the Taurus line up were already pretty well filled.

I must confess my fondness for the easy to conceal, carry & shoot Millennium Pro line.

The only place I saw an area of improvement with them was the take down pin. The newer model Taurus's are using a clone of the Glock disassembly catch.

If this were added to the Millennium Pro line I'd be a happy camper.

But when you add two (or more) compact models with this feature that are 1/2" longer and 4 to 6 oz's heavier, that's not an improvement in my book.

...AND...if they'd just stick to model numbers (as in Glock, S&W etc.) it would be a whole lot easier to keep up with what's being offered.

If you don't continually refer back to their website you're at a loss with "what's the latest and greatest"
 
#19 ·
I would think that Buds Gunshop would kick in a good bit of money for Taurus to streamline its lineup of pistols!
I mean they might actually be able to figure what pictures to post with what guns for a change!-LOL
I really am at a lost with all the different configurations of revolvers and semi autoes they offer.
 
#20 ·
Remington has not changed the 700 in decades, and it is one of the best. Same with the Win. 870 and Colts 1911.
Do a few things well and not a bunch of things so so.
 
#21 ·
The problem, of course, is that we all think that a different gun should go, or be kept.

Remington has not changed the 700 in decades, and it is one of the best
The Remington 700 has been available in more than 100 different variants over those decades. While still a 700, the various barrel lengths and thickness profiles vary considerably. As well the stock shape, maker, and materials.

Same with the Win. 870 and Colts 1911.
Hmmmmm, here and I thought that Remington made the Model 870. ;)

Colt 1911 pistols have had their own QC problems over the years. There are also about 25 different Colt Model 1911s in that list. Officer, Commander, Government, Gold Cup, Combat Carry, Presidente, and on and on. Different barrels, frames, slides, sights, and even operating systems. :D
 
#22 ·
j3hill said:
Remington has not changed the 700 in decades, and it is one of the best. Same with the Win. 870 and Colts 1911.
Do a few things well and not a bunch of things so so.
Well actually Taurus hasn't changed the model 85 or the 92/99 in decades either!
well no more than or less than Remington has changed the 700.
There are some really old stalwarts in the Taurus lineup and some really well made weapons as well.
I do think they try to make way to different models , why not just make variations off a few dozen guns, and then produce the real weird ones like the Judge, the raging Bull, etc on a limited basis.
Yea I know Mooola!
 
#23 ·
Yep, they may have too many models. The catalog goes to 67 pages.
However, to remain competitive, they have to bring new, longer, lower, wider, oops, I mean more features and ease of use, etc., something to entice potential buyers who just have to have the latest and greatest toys.

I know the feeling. I bought guns for a specific purpose and I already have too many.
 
#24 ·
Taurus motto according to that ancient screwball Chinese philosopher, Confusion. "So many models. So little time."

This is kind of like old Lucille Ball, I Love Lucy episode where the Lucy and Ethel are trying to keep up with the chocolate candies as the candy comes down the assembly line.
 
#25 ·
I don't really have an issue with the number of products and variations they make. I do wish however, they would find a more efficient way to catalog and display them. That would reduce the level of confusion about what's offered and help prospective customers sort through them to find the gun that is right for them. I've seen a lot of folks post on here something to the effect of "Gee I had no idea Taurus made one of those".

In this day and age the internet is the first place people go to research a new purchase. If they can't find the information they are looking for with one brand they move on to the next. Taurus is missing the boat when it comes to this. If you Google a Taurus product you will often find far more references to forum posts than you will to a Taurus company website.
 
#26 ·
I think there is a disconnect between Taurus Aramas and here in the U.S.A.

Taurus presents all these new models (some never get off the starting block), discontinues models at times without warning (their perogative though), and introduces other models without any notice,and the list goes on.

Part of being a overseas company that is world wide is being able to concentrate on all the products that they sell world wide, how to do that,and to do what and when. That and communicating what, to whom for sales and service, is going to happen.

I agree with BigSkiff on his points.

Taurus has to make hard decisions on what it is going to do, do it, and do it well in notifying the public.

Taurus, if they are watching from afar, might just pick up on the creative criticisms and do something with them.
 
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